News New Incels.is Rule announcement: Regulation of child erotica and discussion of paedophilia

[Sheogorath]

First it's no loli porn and next thing

I disagree with terms like loli porn.

Pornographos refers to drawings of prostitutes. The Ancient Greek term "porne" means "harlot"

πορνογράφος - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org

IE it only makes sense to apply this term when it's videos of IRL people paid to fuck each other: they are harlots.

If you make a sex movie with your wife and she isn't getting paid to fuck, it's not pornography no matter how raunchy it is (you can go ass to mouth and everything)

πορνεία - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org

Apparently "pornea" was also used, in addition to it's primary meaning of "prostitution", to refer to "fornication" which has a broader usage (I think any unmarried sex)

In which case: you could still make the hardcore sex film w/ your wife, just not anyone else, any sex vids w/ non-wives are fornication and thus pornography.

I don't agree with this usage though. This is where, in Greece, meaning began to fall apart.

Reconstruction:Proto-Indo-European/per- - Wiktionary, the free dictionary

en.wiktionary.org

The proto-indo root term "per-" meant "to sell" so it doesn't make sense to apply it to fornication: only fornication where money or other valuables change hands.

 

[MACHETE]

anime is low T but forbidding things is even lower T

 

[Sheogorath]

Anime faggots and their degeneracy have been green lighted as being a-ok to be members of the forum
if only because this particular sickness is unfortunately so widespread culturally.

 

[Steiner Ex Machina]

View attachment 569684 is kuro from that prisma illya spinoff I haven't gotten around to watching?

It's ovER bro, why don't u just join our discord instead, we will be liek family to u

 

[unuser]

”OH NOOO THE POOR LITTLE INNOCENT NON-EXISENT ANGEL IS BEING SEXUALLY EXPLOITED IN THIS DRAWING, WE SHOULD CALL CHILD PROTECTIVE SERVICES IMMEDIATELY ON ANY MONSTER THAT FAPS TO THEM11!!!11!!!1!!1!!!!”

Furry-tier arguments

 

[Sheogorath]

anime is low T

It's ovER bro, why don't u just join our discord instead, we will be liek family to u

are you suggesting I flee?

The legalese and long winded nature of both our contributions to the new rules is absolutely necessary we feel due to the types of vicious enemies out there that we have in the MSM and various Marxist/Zionist controlled governments of the world.

you know I'm going to find flaws in your phrasing to get my lolis in Link

 

[Steiner Ex Machina]

are you suggesting I flee?

View attachment 569702

nope bro, u can do whatever, I'm just saying that u won't habe to stand any cuckoldry among us

 

[MACHETE]

View attachment 569701View attachment 569700

are you suggesting I flee?

View attachment 569702

you know I'm going to find flaws in your phrasing to get my lolis in Link

View attachment 569703

all i see is drawings made by low T chinkz

 

[Sheogorath]

18 U.S.C. § 1466A does criminalize cartoon porn within the confines of the Miller test, requiring (in part) the government to prove that it lacks any serious literary, artistic, political, or scientific value. Federal obscenity prosecutions are extremely rare nowadays but these laws have been judged facially constitutional as recently as the late 2000s.

do you recall which case in late 2000s? most instances of this being threatened you see someone not fight it all the way to a jury verdict and instead take a plea

Just to clarify, this rule permits moderators to remove only anime depicting sexually explicit conduct.

I would suggest you rephrase that PPEcel as a lot of lewds exist of things from manga which have not received anime adaptations, plus also western stuff usually not termed 'anime'

would suggest something like "illustrated" because that covers comics/toons and manga/anime together

 

[aesthetic_recon]

my dick my choice

i take it back these niggas based

 

[Sheogorath]

Yes. See United States v. Whorley, 550 F.3d 326 (4th Cir. 2008), among other cases.

the 2008 confirmation of Dwight Whorley's initial December 2005 conviction related to 18 U.S.C. 1466 found here

18 U.S. Code § 1466A - Obscene visual representations of the sexual abuse of children

www.law.cornell.edu

I think this relates to Bush's modification of laws in 2003's PROTECT act.

The issue here is (1A) "depicts a minor" should really only apply if you're drawing a real person. Etna and Flonne are not "minors" for example, they are fictional characters.

Also with (1B) with "obscene" is it's court's burden to prove obscenity.

There's also 2A/2B where instead of "obscene" it's "lacks serious L/A/P value" which I'm assuming is a lower burden of proof when talking about more extreme cases where you go beyond "sexually explicit conduct" to intercourse/bestiality/masochism/sadism

This is probably the key point since it changes phrasing from "depicts a minor" (1A) to (2A) "an image that is, or appears to be, of a minor"

This contrast shows the lack of teeth in 1A because it's clearly only in the "is" not "appears to be" area.

I still think "appears to be" has a lot of flexibility though. IMO that only applies to photorealism. You can argue that Lisa Simpson for example does not "appear to be a minor" because she is easily distinguishable from how humans actually look.

- -

anyway back to Whorley:

archive.ph

Whorley's previous conviction on federal child-pornography charges was in 1999. He was sentenced to 46 months in prison to be followed by three years of court-supervised probation.
In January 2003, he had served his sentence and was on supervised release when he violated the terms of his probation and was taken back into custody, according to the U.S. attorney's office.
He was sentenced to an additional 12 months to serve and was released in January 2004. Whorley again violated probation and was arrested in April 2004, which led authorities to the current prosecution.

This is a case of him violating the terms of his probation two consecutive times. So I don't know if we can use this as precedent to interpret how the law applies to those not on probation.

Shut the fuck up. If I want to say I want to fuck a 14 year old foid who already has fucked dozens of Chads to make up for years of inceldom, suffering, and lack of teenage love , I should have the freedom to say it and anyone who has a problem with that can go to hell.

did you even read the reply you quoted? he didn't say anything about your ability to use words, only images

 

[Tjaldur]

Posting loli images for others has never acted like a substitute to having a GF, not sure where you get that.

IMO just helps to make arguments, like people say "X is not hot" and just showing a pic's worth a million words to make them second-guess themselves

Idk hentai in general gives me more comfort than real women have.

are there a lot of greycels posting loli? I thought only men-of-culture years-cels like me did this

I would but I'm already on the register

if they tolerate it maybe it just leads to a softcore world where we can post lolis long as there's no genitalia which is probably a blessing for those of us who can't compartmentalize the 2D dicks polluting images

Mods are not based. They'll never allow this. I don't mind gelbooru pixiv safe stuff

 

[Sheogorath]

Idk hentai in general gives me more comfort than real women have.

agreed but I just mean the act of sharing it here doesn't provide an especially comfort in that sense
my waifu doesn't get cuter by showing her off to others, that's just me trying to help bros out of love for humanity

Mods are not based. They'll never allow this.

the rules are more stringent for actual 3dpd minors in terms of suggestive poses, we seem to be allowed to do suggestive poses if it's 2d long as you can't actually see genitals

will post pics later to what show I mean, maybe on new thread

I don't mind gelbooru pixiv safe stuff

not sure what you mean by this, both sites host hardcore art, you prob thinking of safebooru

 

[fast_curry]

Americans care a lot more about pedos than they do mass shootings; the latter seems to be a national sport at this point.

lmao

 

[Sheogorath]

I told @PPEcel and @Fat Link to sticky this thread not sure why they haven't obeyed me yet

 

[PPEcel]

this requires clarification regarding how far beyond genitalia it refers: does it include nipples, for example?

The rules address the lascivious exhibition/contact of breasts, which would include nipples.

Tired, I'll explain Whorley tmr

 

[Sheogorath]

Tired, I'll explain Whorley tmr

same feel, maybe we should have entire new thread on Bush/Whorley/PROTECT and so on

he's definitely not representative though so I'd be curious to see how 1622 gets appleid to people without a history of conviction for actual CP as Whorley had

kinda curious to get transcripts of his case and how prosecutor phrased stuff too

also any other lesser-known later cases it might have influenced

I think you made those threads on that doctor pizza guy from IT so I respect your legal opinions however we might differ on small concerns

 

[Lv99_BixNood]

It's ovER bro, why don't u just join our discord instead, we will be liek family to u

Trannycord

 

[Steiner Ex Machina]

Trannycord

It's not about the shitty platform bro, it's about the incel frens u make, u are invited too btw

 

[ilieknothing]

Is a picture like this allowed?

it’s not sexual in any way but I was told it is sexual

 

[SentimentalCel]

Can I post cute lolis that are not sexualized like this?
View attachment 569639

Absolutely BASED posting a pic of a Loli that you're not sure whether will get you banned or not in THIS THREAD.

There has been a longstanding debate whether the forum should proscribe only material that is explicitly illegal, in keeping with our traditional commitment to free expression; or whether the Moderation team should go further than what the law requires of them, if only to curb our most undesirable elements.

Generally speaking, child erotica is material relating to children that are used for a sexual purpose, but do not conform to the statutory definition of child pornography. I believe that what some users describe as "Lolicon" would fall into this category.

The forum has never had a rule explicitly regulating child erotica, as it is not necessarily illegal; nor is it necessarily "foid worship" or "gay/trans content". The Moderation team has decided to plug this loophole, so to speak, and prohibit the dissemination of certain child erotica. The team will promulgate the following Rule, which is carefully worded to decrease free expression concerns. The Rule goes into effect immediately.

Spoiler: Emergency Rulemaking Guidance No.1

View: https://imgur.com/a/bfSFkFg

A PDF version is available on request.

As @Fat Link has stated, the Incels.is Rules are a "living document". A degree of flexibility is necessary to allow the Moderation team to address a wide variety of internal and external threats to the presence and culture of our community. There may be additional rules, or amendments to existing rules, in the future, and the Moderation team will always seek community consultation where possible.

Lolis help men not have sex with children irl by acting as a substitute. So even if you care about "saving muh wahmen", banning lolis makes no sense.

Lolis are an expression of free speech; what if you are wrong? Never discount the possibility that ANY opinion you have may be wrong, always allow free speech. Never police speech content, only speech type (ie obvious trolling, shitposting).

Lolis increase male pleasure in a world devoid of justice and are a beautiful artistic aesthetic in their own right; an art form.

We've decided to set the definition of "minor" at 18.

And it will be 25 in 20 years when when the people get their way and make it 25. Then it will be 35, 45, etc. The AoC will not stop going higher and higher, with laws in place to ensure that no one more than 2 years apart is allowed to fuck. You just go along with the dominant cultural zeitgeist, except being "manly" or whatever and "lookist".

[UWSL]Users are still free to debate and discuss their views on the age of consent, they'll just have to use words instead of excessively sexual images.[/UWSL]

So you backpedal, then? You specifically said that you would ban DISCUSSION of pedophilia, and no you don't (thank God). Shouldn't have made the claim in the first place.

Are little girls really "traumatized" by sex with older men, or are they faking it for attention? Or are they taught to be "traumatized" by society? Or are they not "traumatized" at first, but become traumatized once they realize that their action allowed a less domineering male to fuck a higher quality woman than he otherwise would have been able to, thus potentially spreading the "wrong" genes (ie good genes), making men less desperate, and thus decreasing women's power over men? What if it's all just a shit-test? Do you really think that it's more likely that they are really traumatized forever for good reason and there's nothing that can be done about it than any of these things being true?

 

[SoySupreme]

Nothing illegal, it is just drawings

There is no harm done to any real victims but inanimate pencil lines.

I have never posted any porn here nor do I care for others posting porn, but this has to be the single most cucked mod decision I have ever seen. Do you want to turn this place into another politically correct censorship hellhole

censorship is unbased. it straight up isn't even illegal and is very unlikely to risk the site. it seems that freespeech is truly dying on the clear net.

It's over for this forum. First it's no loli porn and next thing you know "no racism/misogyny/transphobia"

it still feels wrong to censor this when even normies would ignore it.

NGL, I have not posted porn or similar content here but I loved the wild west nature of the forum. Seeing posts that triggers normies is lifefuel to me. Censorship of art goes against my free speech philosophy. I also dislike vague subjective laws that focus on technicalities rather than having a clear cut direction (e.g. making rulings based on the supposed age of fictional characters when the concept of human age doesn't apply to them) This change gives me bad memories of the day Reddit, Twitter and Discord implemented similar cucked rules and many accounts I followed disappeared into thin air. Every day, the surface net becomes more and more homogeneous and american globohomo culture and bluepilled morals are being forced upon us.

 

[Dregster]

ain't nobody reading your walls of texts dude

Indeed

such a pretentious cunt he is, looking to nitpick with extreme cases since his autistic threads are the most affected by this

 

[Dregster]

Is a picture like this allowed?

it’s not sexual in any way but I was told it is sexual

Just depends how a mod will percieve it. I wont give much importance to an image like this

 

[TheOnlyWei]

Ban all pedos

Agree!

 

[Bakedcrystal]

Ban all pedos

 

[ThinTinyDickCel]

I don't mind this. I barely saw anyone posting any sexually explicit stuff anyway. But discussion should always be allowed.

 

[AsiaCel]

Don't mind. I was never into kids anyway

 

[yez]

Yeah, ban pedos. They reject women but want a child. And they are whining about why they are virgin

 

[NorthernWind]

I fucking hate the WEST!!!

Just wait bro and the global agecucks will lose .

Founder of Panasonic.

 

[PotatoTomato]

Agecucks.is
It's over.

Exactly. If she makes my dick hard, she's old enough.

Holy BASED

 

[Sheogorath]

 

[highinhibition]

kikes and feds like you love to inseminate lolis and smoke cigars in real life

 

[Ika-Sama]

I'm not against loli porn, but I'm against actual CP.

Don't mind. I was never into kids anyway

tbh

 

[Hubert]

Sounds like a good rule change, pedos need to be shot.

 

[ScandinaviaCel]

other non-illegal stuff like promoting homosexuality and going tranny and fucking trannies is already blocked

I expect it's mostly concern-trolling so we "look better" to guys like IT even though they'll hate us regardless

that or paranoia about feds using obscenity laws to try and take down the new site owners

though more likely feds would use charges to pressure owners into a plea deal to give them more control over the site

I always assume feds fully controlled the site though

so if they did, why would they need to do this? I can see two theories:

1) to give impression they do not

2) some kinda master plan to track IPs of all people who view threads w/ lolicon uploads and call it a CP ring and V& all of us

interesting. I made a thread asking about the "safety" of this website. it got deleted or something.

 

[PPEcel]

the 2008 confirmation of Dwight Whorley's initial December 2005 conviction related to 18 U.S.C. 1466 found here

In United States v. Whorley, 550 F.3d 326 (4th Cir. 2008), the Fourth Circuit addressed, in part, Whorley's contention that 18 U.S.C. § 1466A is unconstitutional under the First Amendment.

The Fourth Circuit disagreed, holding, Id. at 335-337, that:

[R]egardless of whether § 1466A(a)(1) requires an actual minor, it is nonetheless a valid restriction on obscene speech under Miller, not a restriction on non-obscene pornography of the type permitted by Ferber. We thus find Whorley's as-applied constitutional challenge to § 1466A(a)(1) to be without merit.

 

[Caesercel]

Essentially this means you would turn this forum into reddit, good job.

What if that was the intent all along

 

[HarryDresden]

I guess users like wizard are fucking done

 

[Uninvited]

Gay Jew New Janny Rules

 

[Sheogorath]

In United States v. Whorley, 550 F.3d 326 (4th Cir. 2008), the Fourth Circuit addressed, in part, Whorley's contention that 18 U.S.C. § 1466A is unconstitutional under the First Amendment.

The Fourth Circuit disagreed, holding, Id. at 335-337, that:

a valid restriction on obscene speech under Miller,
not a restriction on non-obscene pornography of the type permitted by Ferber

Still remains unclear to me what in particular they're calling "obscene pornography" or "obscene speech" though, in this context.

Like for example with that Canadian dude who got V& for importing a couple loli onaholes (pled down to a peace bond to get them to drop charges) he or one of his friends actually mentioned the specific name of the product so people could go check out the packaging on the onaholes to see what prompted the charges.

But in this case there's such vagueness around the artwork. Like when it came to people spamming the Italian senate w/ anime porn, people could tell you not just the name of the characters (Tifa and this one I forget from Genshin Impact) but also the artists who made the animations, making it easy to look at the limited amount of videos and narrow down what was shown.

Basically I don't have an idea of how realistic the stuff Whorley had was... and for example do we know if the jury got to actually see the images?

I guess users like wizard are fucking done

a newfag like you who barely reads these forums clearly doesn't know my history of posting on a wide variety of topics, not marired to posting lolis

tbh it takes up a lot of time and effort which seems wasted on many who just moralfag/agecuck to peakcock for IT

 

[PPEcel]

Still remains unclear to me what in particular they're calling "obscene pornography" or "obscene speech" though, in this context.

Like for example with that Canadian dude who got V& for importing a couple loli onaholes (pled down to a peace bond to get them to drop charges) he or one of his friends actually mentioned the specific name of the product so people could go check out the packaging on the onaholes to see what prompted the charges.

But in this case there's such vagueness around the artwork. Like when it came to people spamming the Italian senate w/ anime porn, people could tell you not just the name of the characters (Tifa and this one I forget from Genshin Impact) but also the artists who made the animations, making it easy to look at the limited amount of videos and narrow down what was shown.

Basically I don't have an idea of how realistic the stuff Whorley had was... and for example do we know if the jury got to actually see the images?

a newfag like you who barely reads these forums clearly doesn't know my history of posting on a wide variety of topics, not marired to posting lolis

tbh it takes up a lot of time and effort which seems wasted on many who just moralfag/agecuck to peakcock for IT

In an obscenity trial, the jury does get to see the images. This does not necessarily apply to child pornography.

 

[Sheogorath]

In an obscenity trial, the jury does get to see the images. This does not necessarily apply to child pornography.

I would still love to see the transcript here. Do you think a FOIA could get the transcript of not just the original 2003 trial but also his preceding ones?

I want to see what prosecutor said

 

[PPEcel]

I would still love to see the transcript here. Do you think a FOIA could get the transcript of not just the original 2003 trial but also his preceding ones?

I want to see what prosecutor said

You could probably get the transcripts off CM/ECF.

 

[Sheogorath]

You could probably get the transcripts off CM/ECF.

not sure what this is
kinda wondering if I had prosecutor transcript if I could somehow puzzle out if these were pics by any popular artist

2003 is pre-paheal and stuff, so while there were artists active during that time it's more of a struggle to look them up

 

[PPEcel]

not sure what this is
kinda wondering if I had prosecutor transcript if I could somehow puzzle out if these were pics by any popular artist

2003 is pre-paheal and stuff, so while there were artists active during that time it's more of a struggle to look them up

You're not going to be able to know what those images are.

 

[Sheogorath]

You're not going to be able to know what those images are.

they prob didn't get descriptive enough in court but if they mentioned something like "drawn by artist named X" (sometimes artists sign their work) it could at least give a rough guideline as to the realism of that artist's style

 

[PPEcel]

they prob didn't get descriptive enough in court but if they mentioned something like "drawn by artist named X" (sometimes artists sign their work) it could at least give a rough guideline as to the realism of that artist's style

Why do you care lmao

 

[Sheogorath]

Why do you care lmao

because it gives an idea of what sort of content they're going after

like for example did it show genitalia (explicit hardcore) drawings, or merely implied sex (softcore)

 

[PPEcel]

because it gives an idea of what sort of content they're going after

like for example did it show genitalia (explicit hardcore) drawings, or merely implied sex (softcore)

Since it passed the Miller test, it was almost definitely hardcore.