Discussion Essay on why work does not feel rewarding (not for attentionspan-cels)

[I.N.C.E.L.S. Boss]

Sorry for the wall of text, I tried my best to make the writing style as smooth as my english allows me to.

First of all, to give context to what will be disclosed, humans have always lived in small groups called tribes. Once the number of the members gets past a certain threshold which is based on the available resources, the tribe is splitted into two differents groups and so on.
The issue in the modern time is that resources are or at least seem to be inexhaustible, thus the tribe doesn't have to divide and the very notion of a tribe, in face of the sheer reproduction output, becomes so diluted that it doesn't hold sense anymore. You cannot make a tribe of 3 billions inhabitants, the brain is limited as to how much social connections it can compute.

Here are my thoughts on the subject :

The human species sheer survival strength relies on the social connection built with others, everything about humans has evolved towards the acquisition of that survival specialization. We have no sharp claws, no dracula teeth, or gorilla tier strength but evolution has gifted us with a very strong asset.

The essential advantage of that asset is that its mean is the same at its end. We solidify our social connections to the members of the tribe in order to ..... solidify our social connections towards the same members.
To sum it up, that evolutionary asset "steroid"-s itself by itself. I have read some studies hypothesizing that the brain evolved bigger in order to increase the computation capabilities of more social cues (like body language, facial expressions, voice tones) with the purpose of guessing what's on the other's mind.

Think about it. Working for your people in exchange of food and shelter somehow theoretically feels more rewarding than working for somebody you don't know in exchange of the same things.
That's because work, as an evolutionary tool, isn't supposed to be its own end. Work and everything humans do is to cement connections between the members of the tribe.

Once we lose that aspect, once all the necessary biological needs are covered (aka food and shelter), even if the pay increases, what you do will still not feel as rewarding since no inherent purpose is linked to it.
We are not homo economicus, we are homo socialus.

This aspect was lost in our modern societies where we are billions of free electrons, free to go where we want with no nucleus to stick to and guide our trajectory.
This increasing freedom comes with a price and its price is you.

 

[Deleted member 22907]

I am Homo Incelus

 

[I.N.C.E.L.S. Boss]

I am Homo Incelus

A side effect of the modern age.

 

[Deleted member 22572]

A side effect of the modern age.

 

[Lebensmüder]

Sorry for the wall of text, I tried my best to make the writing style as smooth as my english allows me to.

First of all, to give context to what will be disclosed, humans have always lived in small groups called tribes. Once the number of the members gets past a certain threshold which is based on the available resources, the tribe is splitted into two differents groups and so on.
The issue in the modern time is that resources are or at least seem to be inexhaustible, thus the tribe doesn't have to divide and the very notion of a tribe, in face of the sheer reproduction output, becomes so diluted that it doesn't hold sense anymore. You cannot make a tribe of 3 billions inhabitants, the brain is limited as to how much social connections it can compute.

Here are my thoughts on the subject :

The human species sheer survival strength relies on the social connection built with others, everything about humans has evolved towards the acquisition of that survival specialization. We have no sharp claws, no dracula teeth, or gorilla tier strength but evolution has gifted us with a very strong asset.

The essential advantage of that asset is that its mean is the same at its end. We solidify our social connections to the members of the tribe in order to ..... solidify our social connections towards the same members.
To sum it up, that evolutionary asset "steroid"-s itself by itself. I have read some studies hypothesizing that the brain evolved bigger in order to increase the computation capabilities of more social cues (like body language, facial expressions, voice tones) with the purpose of guessing what's on the other's mind.

Think about it. Working for your people in exchange of food and shelter somehow theoretically feels more rewarding than working for somebody you don't know in exchange of the same things.
That's because work, as an evolutionary tool, isn't supposed to be its own end. Work and everything humans do is to cement connections between the members of the tribe.

Once we lose that aspect, once all the necessary biological needs are covered (aka food and shelter), even if the pay increases, what you do will still not feel as rewarding since no inherent purpose is linked to it.
We are not homo economicus, we are homo socialus.

This aspect was lost in our modern societies where we are billions of free electrons, free to go where we want with no nucleus to stick to and guide our trajectory.
This increasing freedom comes with a price and its price is you.

Extremely based post. Extremely high quality. Keep up the good work, read a couple of your posts and wanted to state that.

 

[Ap0calypse]

the true strength of this species is mostly due to the gifted individuals from the past and present who developed the technology that defines our modern world

what makes this small percentage of individuals special? Their cognitive genetic capacity and ability to find pleasure in studying our universe

most humans are only focused on sportsball, politics, videogames, or TV.

 

[TheGoodGuy]

"not for attentionspan-cels"
Too bad that most likely no one will read this since the majority on this site don´t wanna read anythingmore than a few sentences which they can respond. I am even drunk and still I read it.

The human species sheer survival strength relies on the social connection built with others, everything about humans has evolved towards the acquisition of that survival specialization. We have no sharp claws, no dracula teeth, or gorilla tier strength but evolution has gifted us with a very strong asset.

I have written something similiar in my 310 page journal about how modern humans shouldn´t be criminalized for having weapons e.g. pepper sprays, knives, spears, bows, firearms we don´t have thangs, claws or broute strenghts as a gorilla to defend ourselves we only have our minds to craft tools i.e. weapons to defend ourselves against animals and other hostile humans one singular example of this are mass shooting most people are sheeps unable to defend themselves until armed police show up "when SECONDS count police are only MINUTES away" they are completely defenseless because modern society has made self-defense illegal which is a crime against humanity since humanity for hundreds of thousands of years has used weapons like clubs, spears, swords, knives to defend themselves against their enviroment but in only a couple hundred years we have been stripped by this important way of defense as Benjamin Franklin said it "any society that will give up a little security to gain a little safety deserve neither and will lose both.

I am obviously an anarchist if you have to use political terms but I just see humans as animals and we shouldn´t ask a government for the right to defend ourselves.

I have also written a sheer amount about tripes but since I wanna keep this post as short as possible I will just sum it up quickly; we are too many humans on this Earth we used to live in triped of a couple hundred at most everyone knew each other and everyone had a task the reason for so many "mental illnesses" like anxiety, social anxiety, depression etc. is because we are so disconnected, if we (myself included) interacted in an active community everyday like hunting and fishing I wouldn´t have social anxiety because I would be confronted with it everyday for survival and also get validation for contributing to the small community.

 

[StormWind]

I'll try to sum it up for you.

There is too many of us are of low genetic quality and we all need a culling. As we can only handle so many social connections at once to feel safe and welcomed in our own community.

 

[Deleted member 25274]

Extremely based post. Extremely high quality. Keep up the good work, read a couple of your posts and wanted to state that.

 

[modern_grendel]

This aspect was lost in our modern societies where we are billions of free electrons, free to go where we want with no nucleus to stick to and guide our trajectory.
This increasing freedom comes with a price and its price is you.

poetic. I think this is true, and not just with incels. Lonliness (i.e. the lack of deep connections) is a problem for the vast majority. even most foids addicted to social media are frying their pleasure centers looking for that connection, but are getting cheap likes and validation instead. they're like crackheads.

 

[I.N.C.E.L.S. Boss]

the true strength of this species is mostly due to the gifted individuals from the past and present who developed the technology that defines our modern world

what makes this small percentage of individuals special? Their cognitive genetic capacity and ability to find pleasure in studying our universe

most humans are only focused on sportsball, politics, videogames, or TV.

If all humans were high IQ individuals, we would have gone extinct by now.
Variety is necessary to ensure survival of the species in case of unforseen events. And humans are diverse like you stated.

Thought experiment :
Imagine the same species of flies that have two subgroups. One with black wings and one with white wings.
The forest is mainly populated by black trunk trees and a small number of white trunk trees. As you would guess, the white winged flies are the minority since the predators can easilty spot them.
Now imagine for some reason, those trunk black tree turned white and the white winged flies went extinct some time ago. The whole species is now extinct since the black winged ones represent 100% of the population and will get devastated by the predators.

Benjamin Franklin said it "any society that will give up a little security to gain a little safety deserve neither and will lose both.

I have also written a sheer amount about tripes but since I wanna keep this post as short as possible I will just sum it up quickly; we are too many humans on this Earth we used to live in triped of a couple hundred at most everyone knew each other and everyone had a task the reason for so many "mental illnesses" like anxiety, social anxiety, depression etc. is because we are so disconnected, if we (myself included) interacted in an active community everyday like hunting and fishing I wouldn´t have social anxiety because I would be confronted with it everyday for survival and also get validation for contributing to the small community.

Regarding the first point, I wholeheartedly agree.
The ideal citizens to rule for a State are citizens who cannot defend themselves. Suppose they decide to riot ? You could always reallocate some bunch of violent persons into their neighborhood and they will strike fear into the heart of the average citizen.
Fear because the citizen can't defend himself. Fear because the State won't act to defend him since it benefits its interest. Fear because he isn't free to do what he wants anymore and needs to please a mafia.
This tactic is used in ym country which I don't want to disclose due to doxxing potential.

For the second point, there is this expression called "the village idiot" and the equivalent "the city idiot" does not exist. This is because the idiot, even he has lost his mind, was still considered by the members of his tribe as a member. And so, he was given a role and support.
Nowadays, in our so enlightened modern societies, we lock our idiots and even our sane elders in institutions where they have to deal with people they have no connections to.

I used to blame my parents regarding their upbringing based on minimising social interactions, because of this i developped a deeply rooted anxiety and depression which I would never have had if i was confronted to my peers to secure my survival and well-being.

 

[I.N.C.E.L.S. Boss]

I'll try to sum it up for you.

There is too many of us are of low genetic quality and we all need a culling. As we can only handle so many social connections at once to feel safe and welcomed in our own community.

Based translation tbh.

 

[AlexanderTheGreat11]

Didn't read

 

[Yerberito]

I am Homo Incelus

 

[I.N.C.E.L.S. Boss]

Didn't read

Imagine not even having the strength to read the title where it's clearly stated not for attentionspan-cels.

 

[DepressionTookMyIQ]

TLDR: the capitalist gamefication of work called money is not as rewarding as being directly recognized for your contribution by the people around you.

 

[TheDarkEnigma]

"not for attentionspan-cels"
Too bad that most likely no one will read this since the majority on this site don´t wanna read anythingmore than a few sentences which they can respond. I am even drunk and still I read it.


I have written something similiar in my 310 page journal about how modern humans shouldn´t be criminalized for having weapons e.g. pepper sprays, knives, spears, bows, firearms we don´t have thangs, claws or broute strenghts as a gorilla to defend ourselves we only have our minds to craft tools i.e. weapons to defend ourselves against animals and other hostile humans one singular example of this are mass shooting most people are sheeps unable to defend themselves until armed police show up "when SECONDS count police are only MINUTES away" they are completely defenseless because modern society has made self-defense illegal which is a crime against humanity since humanity for hundreds of thousands of years has used weapons like clubs, spears, swords, knives to defend themselves against their enviroment but in only a couple hundred years we have been stripped by this important way of defense as Benjamin Franklin said it "any society that will give up a little security to gain a little safety deserve neither and will lose both.

I am obviously an anarchist if you have to use political terms but I just see humans as animals and we shouldn´t ask a government for the right to defend ourselves.

I have also written a sheer amount about tripes but since I wanna keep this post as short as possible I will just sum it up quickly; we are too many humans on this Earth we used to live in triped of a couple hundred at most everyone knew each other and everyone had a task the reason for so many "mental illnesses" like anxiety, social anxiety, depression etc. is because we are so disconnected, if we (myself included) interacted in an active community everyday like hunting and fishing I wouldn´t have social anxiety because I would be confronted with it everyday for survival and also get validation for contributing to the small community.

That's why the Second Amendment exists in the US Constitution. So that people can protect themselves on their own accord without having to rely on police and a state, and to rise up if anything goes haywire. Life is all about survival of the fittest and who gets the most power. I'm pro-gun and want to live a life of self-sustainability which is why hopefully when I have the resources I want to GTFO this state and go somewhere more secluded where I could live off the grid.

Seriously, if you have written essays and journals about this site, you should seriously consider setting up your own website or somewhere to share your ideas to everyone. Which is why I have a Raspberry Pi to host a site of my own.

And speaking about OP's thread, just be a hunter-gatherer theory. Before the advent of agriculture in the Paleolithic era, people used to work with each other as teams in order to hunt big game and bring the feast home, and then when agriculture and animal husbandry came along in the Neolithic age, we started to farm but still we were self-sufficient and worked together as a family to grow food. It was all like this of course until the Industrial evolution came along through the Early Modern period where we started to wage for big corporations and it became less about working together and more about labor becoming a commodity.

 

[SolitaryConfinement]

Work is indeed intended to be the end itself as opposed to a mean to an end. When done this way, you are correct that it really isn't 'work', it's just doing things that are necessary to sustain the life process for you or for others with whom you have connectedness (who will do the same in turn for you). Well said. As a form of evolutionary advantage and the relationship to social connections--this is true. At the collective level, it's certainly a big part of what has allowed us to adapt to this point. It's still true at the individual level for those who can attain them, I presume (e.g. promotability in an employment environment is all about who you know, beyond looks).

A sense of tribe is completely absent and the macro level, and quite symptomatic for many I imagine, at the micro level. I can only speak for myself that having both a mother and father who have had little to no interaction with their direct relatives, thus leaving me with virtually no extended family, has been a source of social disadvantage (and sadness tbh) throughout my life. Compound this at the societal level and the material comforts aside, we've almost descended into a band of aimless mass wanderers* as a species, as opposed to distinguishable groups discerning our affairs toward higher ends than those afforded by monopoly money (*with the exception of those who control the system that are leading us around by the nose of course).

The bartering system of "I'll do 'x' if you do 'y'" works so well because it is most readily directed toward tangible basic needs and affairs. It's direct, simple, and it gets stuff done. In addition, justice itself is negotiated into all 'deals' at the personal level. Contrast this to the modern principle-agent concept, which is just a dressed up form of plutocratic slavery.

As alluded to in the other thread, most bartering is done at an unspoken level, because in addition to seeking the formation of the connection you spoke of, one wants to feel like they are supporting their tribe; making a contribution to it. There's a lot of volunteerism inherent in this and you'll read about some dying remnant of this ideal every now and then as told by some old guy in Nowhere, Texas, where he'll speak to people looking after each other and pride being taken in keeping their town neat, tidy, and people doing little unrequested favors for each other all the time. It's quite a different mindset contrasted with the world we live in where everything has an assigned "monetary value", including time itself.

I've read the same studies that the title, the money, etc. doesn't matter past a certain point once basic needs are met and I think that's true of most. Mentally, it would be better to have your basic needs met, working for only food and shelter but surrounded by people who you know care about you, then have excess but with no connection to your family and tribe. Connection after all, is a basic need in and of itself.

For the second point, there is this expression called "the village idiot" and the equivalent "the city idiot" does not exist. This is because the idiot, even he has lost his mind, was still considered by the members of his tribe as a member. And so, he was given a role and support.
Nowadays, in our so enlightened modern societies, we lock our idiots and even our sane elders in institutions where they have to deal with people they have no connections to.

I used to blame my parents regarding their upbringing based on minimising social interactions, because of this i developed a deeply rooted anxiety and depression which I would never have had if i was confronted to my peers to secure my survival and well-being.

Yes x 1000. It's no different than how nature operates. For example, some people hate bees because they sometimes sting, but killing off all the bees would eventually reap massive problems downstream in the ecosystem in terms of both plant and animal life (it's already happened in certain places where bees are dying off for one reason or another). You cannot cut something off from the whole and expect the whole to not change in some way, shape, or form.

The human ecosystem is no different. This notion of a "role" is extremely vital for procuring a healthy society for this exact reason. Taking this away (i.e. banishing/acting against an unwanted element of society) will always and without fail, provoke a corresponding equal and opposite reaction from that very element. He who is without a role and is cast off, will respond in one of two ways: through isolation, withdraw, and perhaps suicide (though largely ignored, these cause many grave issues for society), or acts of violence/revenge against the society that has forsaken him (causes more urgent issues, hence why this gets all the attention). Either way, there is no third option so long as the disregarded individual remains unintegrated from the whole.

The fact they want certain elements of society to just be locked away to rot in a closet (including incels) runs in complete contrast to natural law itself. This is very old knowledge--we're literally talking about the law of entropy at a societal level. This is in part why the collapse of the current order is inevitable--it cannot be stopped at this point. Unfortunately, what has already been planned to follow will be worse in many ways.

In the example from your personal life, you're correct that the 'cure' for anxiety and depression was for your parents to have exposed you to your peers at an early age. The mind, like nature itself, is always seeking a state of homeostasis and when cut off from an element it needs to form this cohesion (in this case the social interaction), pathology of some sort develops in its place (relatable from personal experience btw). As an aside, it's amazing how parents are so damned stupid when it comes to their bewilderment as to why their children develop social anxiety or autistic personalities in light of conditions they themselves created during the formative years of life. The only complete 'cure' to such things is to never establish the conditions which allow this to take root in the child in the first place. It really isn't that fucking hard to do either.

This idea of the village idiot or those struggling in life having their place and being supported for no other reason than that they are part of the group, has been unironically lost in our highly competitive, hamster wheel running to nowhere society. Similar to the parent example, normies are totally clueless as to the downstream impacts this has. But this is what you get when you live in clown world, where to normies, family is just a group of flatmates, while 'friends'...well, they have 900 of them according to Facebook...and 'tribe' sounds like a term last used in the bronze age.

But likewise in clown world, you don't really know anyone and you aren't really connected to anything. You're born, you live, you die, and your value as person is measured in a trite amount of fiat currency, whilst your labor is extracted and exploited to build a system which is hellbent on destroying you, and with time, most of humanity.

 

[based_meme]

Extremely based post. Extremely high quality. Keep up the good work, read a couple of your posts and wanted to state that.

 

[TheDarkEnigma]

Extremely based post. Extremely high quality. Keep up the good work, read a couple of your posts and wanted to state that.

tl;dr

 

[ItsOver4cel]

I am Homo Incelus

same

 

[TheGoodGuy]

That's why the Second Amendment exists in the US Constitution. So that people can protect themselves on their own accord without having to rely on police and a state, and to rise up if anything goes haywire. Life is all about survival of the fittest and who gets the most power. I'm pro-gun and want to live a life of self-sustainability which is why hopefully when I have the resources I want to GTFO this state and go somewhere more secluded where I could live off the grid.

Unfortunately the whole world has been taken over by governments the only way to go off the grid is like moving to a jungle, I live in the north and like this climate yet if I wanted to get out of the government I couldn´t, if I took a bow, rifle, shotgun on my back and just started walking I would be arrested or shot and killed if I resisted and even if I wanted to go to another "country" I couldn´t because of the imaginary borders around the world, there is no such thing as freedom anymore people traited their freedom for security; sure in a totally free world (anarchistic) like life was thousands of years ago it was more dangerous but people were free.

And speaking about OP's thread, just be a hunter-gatherer theory. Before the advent of agriculture in the Paleolithic era, people used to work with each other as teams in order to hunt big game and bring the feast home, and then when agriculture and animal husbandry came along in the Neolithic age, we started to farm but still we were self-sufficient and worked together as a family to grow food. It was all like this of course until the Industrial evolution came along through the Early Modern period where we started to wage for big corporations and it became less about working together and more about labor becoming a commodity.

That must also feel so satisfying/validating to bring home a large kill/food for the small community compared to just get a small paycheck every month, the only ones who probably feel proud of their paychecks are the rich people but for normal everyday people they won´t feel the validation of a tripe/community for it and everyone who has either fished knows how satisfying it is to have caught those fish to feed your family.

 

[slimshady]

High Iq. Philosophycel