JFL Can ruzzian orcs explain this to me?

[Mortis]

He literally took his honeymoon to the Soviet Union, expressed admiration for Fidel Castro as well as other Latin American revolutionaries, and was much more radical than his later moderation (meant to make him palatable for running as president in the Democratic Party) suggests.

I don't care what location he chose for his honeymoon and there's people across the whole of the political spectrum that can admire what Fidel pulled off because it is an objectively impressive feat? Whatever happend to looking at policy postions in order to find out a person's political stance? He's obviously aiming for a scandinavian social democratic model. It's political analysis like this that make

political conversation insufferable.

processes and events

That's great that I absolutely don't deny the importance of these things because, once again, that's not what the thread is about.

The fact is that there would not be a war right now if Ukraine agreed to give Donetsk and Lugansk autonomy, and agreed to never join NATO.

I am sorry, Ukraine is an independent nation that can join ANY military alliance it wants, and can agree not to give up parts of THEIR OWN SOVEREIGN TERRITORY.

Russian apologists have COMPLETELY lost their minds.

 

[DepravedAndDeprived]

Gay marriage>Russian savages

90% - 4 day ban Promoting/Supporting LGBTQ

Based mods JFL

 

[DepravedAndDeprived]

The only position that would make sense for based individuals would be indifference

 

[DepravedAndDeprived]

The fact is that there would not be a war right now if Ukraine agreed to give Donetsk and Lugansk autonomy, and agreed to never join NATO. Things which will end up being the case anyway after the war is concluded

They didn't agree to these terms because America and the West were there to prop them up.

Has that hill been worth the hundreds of thousands of people who have died over it? From an American perspective, sure, because Americans aren't dying, only Ukrainians and Russians are.

But if you've actually read the history of the region like me, and well before the region was topical in current events, then you would understand the complexities at play and not be so drawn towards labels. Indeed, one of the main things you learn in history is to actually think about processes and events, not petty labels and the presuppositions they come with.

High IQ. Russia's demands are entirely reasonable. The MSM narrative of Russia wanting to invade Europe is a massive fucking meme. And frankly everyone outside the West knows this.

The CIA-backed Orange Revolution and ousting of Yanukovych tells you everything you need to know about the present Ukraine situation It's all a Western psyop.

At the end of the day though, I fucking hate Russia and I fucking hate Ukraine so I don't mind if they keep on killing each other.

 

[DepravedAndDeprived]

I am sorry, Ukraine is an independent nation that can join ANY military alliance it wants, and can agree not to give up parts of THEIR OWN SOVEREIGN TERRITORY.

It doesn't work like that, for at least two reasons.

• Geopolitics is a power struggle determined by the superpowers. That's just the way it is. For exactly the same reasons, a country like Belgium cannot leave NATO and just join a military alliance with Russia.
  
  
• Even if you disregard the first point, it's not 'Ukraine' who wants to join NATO. Ukraine is absolutely NOT a democracy, and absolutely does NOT represent the will of the people. Ukraine has been the stage of CIA-backed coups, and the (Jewish!) president has without any doubt been installed under the influence of the West. It is well-known, for instance, that the vast majority of Crimean citizens supported joining Russia over Ukraine. The MSM is silent about this.

 

[Mortis]

Ukraine is absolutely NOT a democracy, and absolutely does NOT represent the will of the people.

What? Look at the polls, Ukrainians definitely did want to join the EU/NATO...

Ukraine has been the stage of CIA-backed coups

Aaaaand the conspiracy theory that is backed by 0 evidence always has to come to play when I talk to retarded russian defenders.

(Jewish!)

Da joooooos

Crimean citizens

Crimea has been pumped full of russians by russia. And those referendums were thrown out by the UN because they population were demonstrably being pressured.

 

[Mortis]

, a country like Belgium cannot leave NATO and just join a military alliance with Russia.

If you genuinely think that belgium would get invaded by NATO because they want to leave and join another pact you are operating from a mindset were you delude yourself that other countries would react with such gross incompetence as russia did.

 

[Raider919]

these putin fans on here are fucking deluded. putrid will stick all you idiots in a camp for being anything besides a normal russtard

 

[NorthernWind]

There's no real big reason behind it other than we just hate Russia less than we hate NATO, Russia invading Ukraine denies NATO another ally.

This.
No one forced NATO near Russia.
Could maintain their 1997 boundaries.

 

[NorthernWind]

I am sorry, Ukraine is an independent nation that can join ANY military alliance it wants, and can agree not to give up parts of THEIR OWN SOVEREIGN TERRITORY.

Would the US let Canada leave NATO and join military union with China and place Chinese military bases with nuclear weapons near US border?

 

[DonezoTheClown]

I don't care about the Russia stuff but this caught my eye:

I don't care what location he chose for his honeymoon and there's people across the whole of the political spectrum that can admire what Fidel pulled off because it is an objectively impressive feat?

So bad faith. Just ignore someones past and only focus on what they do now, nobody does this and rightfully so. If you believe this you'd have to believe anti-racist Hitler in Israel as well.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HkAh6bujn14

Whatever happend to looking at policy postions in order to find out a person's political stance?

I don't know ask the people on the left who call anybody with even the most milquetoast anti-woke policies a fascist.

He's obviously aiming for a scandinavian social democratic model. It's political analysis like this that make

Who do you think self-proclaimed communists would vote for? Every communist hides behind that social democrat title. "Guys Wilders and Baudet don't identify as racists, how can they be racist".

 

[Atavistic Autist]

I am sorry, Stacy is an independent woman that can join ANY relationship she wants, and can agree not to put out parts of THEIR OWN BODY.

Incels have COMPLETELY lost their minds.

 

[Mortis]

Just ignore someones past and only focus on what they do now

Is Biden based because he used to make anti-black legislation? Is Hillary based because she called black super predators? You wouldn't do this with anything else.

Guys Wilders and Baudet don't identify as racists, how can they be racist

I wouldn't say they're racist but definitely islamophobic. Also JFL at the turning point USA quote XD. Socialism can be a road to communism but I fail to see how any of that is relevant here.

 

[Mortis]

@Atavistic Autist do you think you can just go up to women and rape them?

 

[Atavistic Autist]

@Atavistic Autist do you think you can just go up to women and rape them?

The Russian-Ukrainian conflict is more akin to domestic violence, insofar as Russia and Ukraine have a historical relationship going back to the very founding of East Slavic civilization in Kieven Rus'.

Due to historical circumstances (namely, the Polish colonization of Ukraine), Ukraine grew separate from Russia, but Russia never grew separate from Ukraine.

In the Russian Empire, Ukrainians were referred to as Little Russians, whereas Russians proper were referred to as Great Russians. Guess which one is the woman?

Btw, this history is what makes the Battle of Mariupol so significant, the city being situated as it is on the Azov Sea. The coastline of this sea is where the first East Slavic settlements were built.

So this war is partly a struggle for the mantle of East Slavic civilization.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

In the Russian Empire, Ukrainians were referred to as Little Russians, whereas Russians proper were referred to as Great Russians. Guess which one is the woman?

Hence I read a history book about a decade ago which referred to Lenin giving the Ukrainian SSR the "Great Russian territory of the Donbas" in order to bequeath it an industrial region -- communism being an industrial political philosophy and all.

This is the progenitor of this war.

 

[BoliMeKurac]

Zelenky the begger gets every month a huge amount of money from the western governments.

Meanwhile Western europe is getting fucked by inflation, high energy costs, muslims. While wages don't change that much.

The middle class is pissed and has a middle finger attitude towards Zelensky and their current governments who are more interessted in foreign policy instead of what's going on in theirbown Nations

Ask yourself, is your current government scared of the next elections

 

[Mortis]

Zelenky the begger gets every month a huge amount of money from the western governments.

He doesn't get money, he gets old equipment. How are you going to fight high energy costs with dusty tanks and fighter jets?

 

[Atavistic Autist]

Is Biden based because he used to make anti-black legislation? Is Hillary based because she called black super predators? You wouldn't do this with anything else.

Biden and $Hillary have never pretended to be anything other than slivering snakes and social climbers who'll promote whatever they need to in order to gain power. This is why their political careers are filled with contradictions. They are simply empty suits.

Bernie Sanders is different; he was an actually a principled socialist, but moderated his message specifically in order to have a wider appeal in his presidential campaigns. Most of the moderation was simply rhetorical. "Social democrat" vs. "socialist" is just semantics, although the former developed a reputation in certain contexts (like Germany) for reformist instead of revolutionary tendencies. Yet Bernie Sanders lavished praise on socialist revolutionaries in particular, like Fidel Castro and Daniel Ortega, so what does that indicate?

I am not even criticizing him for this; it's a breath of fresh air to see somebody with principles in the US Congress. I was just making a point against your thread by bringing up Bernie Sanders, and you're playing dumb on the issue because you don't want to acknowledge that your logic is a bit foolish.

I wouldn't say they're racist but definitely islamophobic. Also JFL at the turning point USA quote XD. Socialism can be a road to communism but I fail to see how any of that is relevant here.

It's very relevant because I struck at the premise of your thread.

You keep being obsessed with stormlords supporting Russia even though muh Russia is Soviet

Well, why didn't Bernie Sanders support the Serbian socialist Milošević when Bill Clinton invoked the NATO alliance to target him and his forces? Milošević was the leader of the Socialist Party of Serbia until 2006! He never stopped calling himself a socialist or moderated his message, even as Yugoslavia disintegrated!

It's actually a very illustrative comparison because the social alliance that Bernie Sanders had with Bill Clinton and the Democratic Party was more important to him than any international solidarity with his political peers. This is an example of how political alliances can be complex and not necessarily make sense.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

Also, the Yugoslav War happened closer to when Bernie Sanders was praising Castro and Ortega than his moderated presidential campaigns @Mortis

So omg, why are MUH SOCIALISTS not standing up for their fellow socialist and allowing the capitalists to ruin a great socialist nation?

 

[Mortis]

The Russian-Ukrainian conflict is more akin to domestic violence, insofar as Russia and Ukraine have a historical relationship going back to the very founding of East Slavic civilization in Kieven Rus'.

Due to historical circumstances (namely, the Polish colonization of Ukraine), Ukraine grew separate from Russia, but Russia never grew separate from Ukraine.

In the Russian Empire, Ukrainians were referred to as Little Russians, whereas Russians proper were referred to as Great Russians. Guess which one is the woman?

Btw, this history is what makes the Battle of Mariupol so significant, the city being situated as it is on the Azov Sea. The coastline of this sea is where the first East Slavic settlements were built.

So this war is partly a struggle for the mantle of East Slavic civilization.

History can be great descrpitvely but you should never use it to justify modern prescriptions.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

He doesn't get money

True. Ukraine is now billions of dollars in debt. It was already one of the poorest countries in Europe before the war started, but now it's completely ogre.

It's so bad that even if Ukraine wins the war against Russia, it won't have any independence or sovereignty to speak of, as its economic resources and infrastructure are pimped out for shekels.

Ukrainians are dying in this war in an effort to be economic slaves to hedge funds in Jew York City, instead of economic slaves to Russian oligarchs

 

[Mortis]

slivering snakes and social climbers who'll promote whatever they need to in order to gain power.

T. Every politician ever.

Yet Bernie Sanders lavished praise on socialist revolutionaries in particular, like Fidel Castro and Daniel Ortega, so what does that indicate?

Once again rightoids also praised those people because you can disagree with someone and still recognise an impressive feat.

Milošević

Maybe because it isn't high IQ to start supporting a convicted war criminal, that commited multiple crimes against humanity and that was at the time at war with the US.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

History can be great descrpitvely but you should never use it to justify modern prescriptions.

This is tantamount to a tautology, given that "modern prescriptions" means little more than "NATO and American hegemony"

If you can only use NATO and American hegemony to justify modern prescriptions, then that's tautological af tbh

 

[Mortis]

great socialist nation?

Did you know why clinton ordered the bombing runs? Leftist also aren't supporting isreal while it is highly sympathetic towards communism and has a rich communist history.

The same reason why most lefties aren't stalinists, because once you start committing genocides you can't just play the buddy politics card.

 

[Mortis]

Ukrainians are dying in this war in an effort to be economic slaves to hedge funds in Jew York City, instead of economic slaves to Russian oligarchs

Thanks russia!

 

[Atavistic Autist]

Once again rightoids also praised those people because you can disagree with someone and still recognise an impressive feat.

Nigga, if you praise Fidel Castro in US politics as a self-proclaimed socialist, then you are being purposefully provocative, not just "recognizing an impressive feat"

It would be like being a far-right politician "recognizing the impressive feat" of Hitler in steering Germany through the Great Depression and stopping communism from taking over his country after Weimar

Maybe because it isn't high IQ to start supporting a convicted war criminal, that commited multiple crimes against humanity and that was at the time at war with the US.

He was at war with the US because the US declared war on him.

The US was also effectively (and often in reality) at war against the Soviet Union and Latin American socialist regimes during the Cold War, but this didn't stop Bernie Sanders

 

[Atavistic Autist]

Did you know why clinton ordered the bombing runs?

Fake concentration camp footage, where a photographer showed Bosnians through a fence, who were actually standing outside of the fence? Yet it was portrayed as though they were inside?

Atrocity propaganda, like what NATO used to justify overthowing Gaddafi in Libya?

Daniel Ortega, who Bernie Sanders praised, was also committing human rights violations at about the same time as the Yugoslav War and was an enemy of US foreign policy.

Leftist also aren't supporting isreal while it is highly sympathetic towards communism and has a rich communist history.

Modern Israel is controlled by the far-right Likud Party, which is fascistic

 

[Mortis]

It would be like being a far-right politician "recognizing the impressive feat" of Hitler in steering Germany through the Great Depression and stopping communism from taking over his country after Weimar

Rigtoids in the US did that multiple times tho.

The US was also effectively (and often in reality) at war against the Soviet Union and Latin American socialist regimes during the Cold War, but this didn't stop Bernie Sanders

It wasn't an official honeymoon to the ussr btw it was more of a visit to strengthen relations, he calls it weird himself. Also I don't think the USA was ever officially at war with any latin american countries. People didn't know about CIA's deep covered operations to coup goverments back then.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

Thanks russia!

The fact is that Russia has more of a right to be waving its dick around Ukraine, than America has a right to be meddling in the affairs of the country.

It's for similar geopolitical reasons as America established the Monroe Doctrine, which prohibited foreign meddling in Latin America, which was declared an American sphere of influence (an exclusive American domain of meddling). This made America feel justified in constantly overthrowing socialist regimes in Latin America, for example.

Except Russia is actually more justified in its sphere of influence over Ukraine, given Russia's consanguineous relationship with Ukraine. Latin America, by comparison, has very little in common with the United States socially and culturally. Except insofar as the US has been getting Mestizo'd up in recent times.

 

[Mortis]

Fake concentration camp footage

I only slept for 4 hours due to insomnia last night. I am not going to open the conspiracy can of worms

basically fascistic

In what definition of fascism does liberal democracy fit?

 

[Mortis]

waving its dick around Ukraine

Nearing half a million dead on both sides isn't "waving your dick around". What the DPRK does is waving it's dick around.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

Nearing half a million dead on both sides isn't "waving your dick around". What the DPRK does is waving it's dick around.

I was referring there to the likes of Victoria Nuland, and other soft power intrigues before the war started.

 

[Mortis]

I was referring there to the likes of Victoria Nuland, and other soft power intrigues before the war started.

Well they kinda are doing more than that now aren't they.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

I only slept for 4 hours due to insomnia last night. I am not going to open the conspiracy can of worms

There's no conspiracy about wars being precipitated by atrocity propaganda.

If America cared so much about Muslim civilians in Bosnia, then why did they kill hundreds of thousands of Iraqis with economic sanctions alone at the EXACT SAME TIME?

This is all theater. It's just like how people claim that immigrants must be welcomed for humanitarian reasons, but the only reason these poor and dirty masses are tolerated by the oligarchs who run our countries is because they provide cheap labor.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

Well they kinda are doing more than that now aren't they.

Yes, because America did not stop its covert operations in Ukraine, and sought to detach it from the Russian sphere.

Make no mistake: America was trudging where it didn't belong in an imperial dick waving contest with Russia. Encroaching its influence upon lands that are so historically, culturally, and geographically close to Russia, that it would be tantamount to Canada being made hostile towards the US.

Or indeed, Cuba being made hostile towards the US and nuclear missiles being based there. Or Mexico being made hostile towards the US (the Zimmerman telegram).

 

[Mortis]

If America cared so much about Muslim civilians in Bosnia, then why did they kill hundreds of thousands of Iraqis with economic sanctions alone at the EXACT SAME TIME?

The USA sees all the civilians in iraq as collateral. Not to say that's right but in their eyes it's something completely different.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

It's just like how people claim that immigrants must be welcomed for humanitarian reasons, but the only reason these poor and dirty masses are tolerated by the oligarchs who run our countries is because they provide cheap labor.

This is something that Bernie Sanders once admitted BTW

 

[Atavistic Autist]

The USA sees all the civilians in iraq as collateral. Not to say that's right but in their eyes it's something completely different.

Yes, which goes to show that wars cannot be judged based upon the humanitarian pretenses that are used as casus belli.

Even Hitler used humanitarian casus belli in his invasion of Poland, for example, which was ostensibly meant to "protect German civilians" who were being "abused by the Poles."

 

[Gott _mit _uns94]

This is a j00ish operation to kill as many slavic man as possible and drain world economys, moving thwords agenda 2030.

ZELENSKY IS A J00, AND PUTIN SURRUNDED BY THEM.

 

[Mortis]

Would the US let Canada leave NATO and join military union with China and place Chinese military bases with nuclear weapons near US border?

I have no idea, and I am not going to use an imaginary scenario to justify the destruction of civilian cities and a ravaging war that is going on in reality today.

 

[DonezoTheClown]

Is Biden based because he used to make anti-black legislation? Is Hillary based because she called black super predators? You wouldn't do this with anything else.

Valid point but I would do it for anti-racist Hitler and also for Bernie. Maybe because actions speak louder than words.

I wouldn't say they're racist but definitely islamophobic. Also JFL at the turning point USA quote XD. Socialism can be a road to communism but I fail to see how any of that is relevant here.

Baudet spoke to Jared Taylor he's definitely racist but not in the boogeyman sense of the word that he hates every individual of that race but more that he probably understands race is real and wants to keep Europe white. But that's besides the point that you don't have to identify as something to support it.

The quote is relevant because the same can apply to democratic socialism leading to socialism leading to communism. Same way I'll vote for a rightwing guy who wants to stop immigration even though my ultimate goal is remigration and deportation.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

I have no idea, and I am not going to use an imaginary scenario to justify the destruction of civilian cities and a ravaging war that is going on in reality today.

Unlike in Gaza, the cities of Eastern Ukraine are almost entirely vacated where the fighting is raging.

Israel has killed more civilians in Gaza by many multiples than Russia has killed Ukrainian civilians in this war. Even though the Russo-Ukrainian War has lasted much longer

 

[Mortis]

Unlike in Gaza, the cities of Eastern Ukraine are almost entirely vacated where the fighting is raging.

Notice how I said "destruction of civilian cities" and not the killing of them (while russian orcs are killing plenty of civilians)

 

[Mortis]

race is real and wants to keep Europe white.

Maybe it's just a difference in perspective because I don't think there's anything racist about thinking this.

democratic socialism leading to socialism leading to communism.

Slippery slope fallacy tbh.

 

[Atavistic Autist]

Notice how I said "destruction of civilian cities" and not the killing of them (while russian orcs are killing plenty of civilians)

Yes, I noticed, but "civilian city" is yet another tautology and would imply to someone uninformed on the situation that civilians are being killed en masse.

What type of a city is not "civilian?"

 

[Mortis]

Yes, I noticed, but "civilian city" is yet another tautology and would imply to someone uninformed that civilians are being killed en masse.

My debate tactics have been revealed...

 

[Atavistic Autist]

My debate tactics have been revealed...