Serious It is a waste of time to convince someone that already has their mind made up

[Master]

Ultimately it is a waste of time to convince someone of your position if they're deeply entrenched in their beliefs. For example, there is no need to argue with many people from IT on their beliefs because most of them are deeply entrenched in their beliefs about incels. Deeply held beliefs are hard to shake, and it is usually not worth engaging with someone that has deeply held beliefs as you are probably unlikely to change their mind.

If you want to change a persons mind, you need to target those that are on the fence about a subject. Someone that is more open to listening to new ideas is more likely to hear you out over the ideologue that has already made their mind up. This is why politicans cater to people that are more towards the center than on the fringes. Most people don't have extreme ideological beliefs, so most political campaigns target people that are more like to be swayed.

My point is that it is useless trying to sway someone that is extreme in their beliefs and/or are deeply entrenched in them. You are better off trying to convince someone that hasn't "taken a side" or has more moderate beliefs.

 

[Billowel]

wonder what made master make this thread.

 

[bigantennaemay1]

Only time it's worth arguing with someone who's made up their mind is when there are fence-sitters watching the argument.

 

[zekr]

Yeah this is 100% true. No one would argue that minds need to be changed while on the battlefield and what is war if not 2 or more conflicting belief systems battling it out in the material world. This is why you need to plant the seeds of a particular ideology at a young age otherwise it's incredibly difficult for mass conversion the older a populous becomes.

 

[FinnCel]

[UWSL]I want lookism/blackpill to be false.[/UWSL]
[UWSL]But it won't make it false[/UWSL]

 

[subhuman]

Yeah I stopped arguing with people on the internet. It’s just a waste of my time.

This is why we don’t need a section to argue with normies and foids. It’s an exercise in futility

 

[Fat Link]

wonder what made master make this thread.

Probably all the dumbasses and drooling tards that interact with our incels.is Twitter account on a daily basis.

 

[Incline]

Ultimately it is a waste of time to convince someone of your position if they're deeply entrenched in their beliefs. For example, there is no need to argue with many people from IT on their beliefs because most of them are deeply entrenched in their beliefs about incels. Deeply held beliefs are hard to shake, and it is usually not worth engaging with someone that has deeply held beliefs as you are probably unlikely to change their mind.

If you want to change a persons mind, you need to target those that are on the fence about a subject. Someone that is more open to listening to new ideas is more likely to hear you out over the ideologue that has already made their mind up. This is why politicans cater to people that are more towards the center than on the fringes. Most people don't have extreme ideological beliefs, so most political campaigns target people that are more like to be swayed.

My point is that it is useless trying to sway someone that is extreme in their beliefs and/or are deeply entrenched in them. You are better off trying to convince someone that hasn't "taken a side" or has more moderate beliefs.

Why even argue with anyone about blackpill. It's like arguing with people that gravity doesn't exist it's pointless. Blackpill doesn't need arguing for its self evident.

 

[Deleted member 9758]

tbh I don't see why people here get so worked up over ITcels. Like most redditors, they're complete losers and have no influence on anything. Nobody normal does what they do.

 

[Osentaku Otje]

i found it's hard for someone to change if they do'nt have a problem
people are more open to new ideas if there's a problem to fix

but Chads and foids live happy lives they have no reason to accept / try to understand negative views

 

[LDARbeforeROPE]

wonder what made master make this thread.

Twitter probably

 

[BlkPillPres]

Ultimately it is a waste of time to convince someone of your position if they're deeply entrenched in their beliefs. For example, there is no need to argue with many people from IT on their beliefs because most of them are deeply entrenched in their beliefs about incels. Deeply held beliefs are hard to shake, and it is usually not worth engaging with someone that has deeply held beliefs as you are probably unlikely to change their mind.

If you want to change a persons mind, you need to target those that are on the fence about a subject. Someone that is more open to listening to new ideas is more likely to hear you out over the ideologue that has already made their mind up. This is why politicans cater to people that are more towards the center than on the fringes. Most people don't have extreme ideological beliefs, so most political campaigns target people that are more like to be swayed.

My point is that it is useless trying to sway someone that is extreme in their beliefs and/or are deeply entrenched in them. You are better off trying to convince someone that hasn't "taken a side" or has more moderate beliefs.

I would say it's much worse than that. I would have titled this thread:
"It is a waste of time to convince someone that directly benefits from your misfortune"

This is the part that I think a lot of incels are forgetting.

It's not merely that normies have deeply held beliefs so they simply can't believe or comprehend our position.

These people aren't fucking stupid, they know full well what were saying is the truth, they quite literally just don't give a fuck, as they expect men like us to "suck it up" and "take one for the team".

They are all very much complicit in this system that negatively impacts our lives, and they are fully aware of the things were talking about before we even bring it up.

But in order for others to win, some people have to lose. Our suffering and misfortune is to the collective benefit of normies. So they will feign ignorance or ignore the evidence.


I will not give plausible deniability to normies and speak as if "they just need convincing", but they can't be convinced due to strongly held biases. That's not the reality. You can go to reddit right now and see posts from people saying they know they are gaslighting incels and they don't care because "incels aren't entitled to women's bodies".

The "Chad" meme is literally a part of normie meme culture, they are all fully aware of the black pill, they just don't give a fuck.

So trying to convince them of anything is pointless, because they will just gaslight you on purpose.

The truth doesn't matter, what matters is if something benefits X group or not.

Us getting what we want doesn't benefit the collective, so they don't care. It's that simple.

 

[Master]

I would say it's much worse than that. I would have titled this thread:
"It is a waste of time to convince someone that directly benefits from your misfortune"

This is the part that I think a lot of incels are forgetting.

It's not merely that normies have deeply held beliefs so they simply can't believe or comprehend our position.

These people aren't fucking stupid, they know full well what were saying is the truth, they quite literally just don't give a fuck, as they expect men like us to "suck it up" and "take one for the team".

They are all very much complicit in this system that negatively impacts our lives, and they are fully aware of the things were talking about before we even bring it up.

But in order for others to win, some people have to lose. Our suffering and misfortune is to the collective benefit of normies. So they will feign ignorance or ignore the evidence.


I will not give plausible deniability to normies and speak as if "they just need convincing", but they can't be convinced due to strongly held biases. That's not the reality. You can go to reddit right now and see posts from people saying they know they are gaslighting incels and they don't care because "incels aren't entitled to women's bodies".

The "Chad" meme is literally a part of normie meme culture, they are all fully aware of the black pill, they just don't give a fuck.

So trying to convince them of anything is pointless, because they will just gaslight you on purpose.

The truth doesn't matter, what matters is if something benefits X group or not.

Us getting what we want doesn't benefit the collective, so they don't care. It's that simple.

Exactly this.

Like you said, for there to be winners, there have to be losers. We are the losers.

 

[Fat Link]

I would say it's much worse than that. I would have titled this thread:
"It is a waste of time to convince someone that directly benefits from your misfortune"

This is the part that I think a lot of incels are forgetting.

It's not merely that normies have deeply held beliefs so they simply can't believe or comprehend our position.

These people aren't fucking stupid, they know full well what were saying is the truth, they quite literally just don't give a fuck, as they expect men like us to "suck it up" and "take one for the team".

They are all very much complicit in this system that negatively impacts our lives, and they are fully aware of the things were talking about before we even bring it up.

But in order for others to win, some people have to lose. Our suffering and misfortune is to the collective benefit of normies. So they will feign ignorance or ignore the evidence.


I will not give plausible deniability to normies and speak as if "they just need convincing", but they can't be convinced due to strongly held biases. That's not the reality. You can go to reddit right now and see posts from people saying they know they are gaslighting incels and they don't care because "incels aren't entitled to women's bodies".

The "Chad" meme is literally a part of normie meme culture, they are all fully aware of the black pill, they just don't give a fuck.

So trying to convince them of anything is pointless, because they will just gaslight you on purpose.

The truth doesn't matter, what matters is if something benefits X group or not.

Us getting what we want doesn't benefit the collective, so they don't care. It's that simple.

The only viable solution is as in the past ie arranged marriages and men working hard enough to accumulate enough wealth to present to a girl’s father as a dowry (or however that’s spelled?) and thereby prove his worthiness as a provider.

The naturally ignorant and childlike female should have no say in the matter and be absolutely shielded her entire life from seeing super attractive giga Chad type men so she will naturally acquiesce to the match and be a content housewife simply happy to have a husband.

The reason we lost the glorious above situation is because Jews needed another means to manipulate and control the genders for their evil purposes and now we’re basically fucked and that includes the women as well in the negative non sexual connotation of the word but they’re as usual too dumb to see it.

Getting beat up by various thug pro athlete Chads and Tyrones or being abandoned by standard Chads when pregnant still isn’t enough to show these dumbass feminist women they’ve gotten a raw deal too.

Also since men generally enjoy seeing and or keeping other men down we can’t depend on most of our own gender helping us reverse this awful situation either.

The only thing left I suppose is to hope ol Vlad isn’t a complete Jewish puppet and does the world a favor and Tsar bombas London, Tel Aviv and New York.

And Beijing too while he’s at it.

 

[Deleted member 42848]

Also since men generally enjoy seeing and or keeping other men down we can’t depend on most of our own gender helping us reverse this awful situation either.

my hypothesis is this comes from encouragement of the Stacys that Chad's fuck because Stacys like this kind of brutish alpha male behavior.

Coupled with the fact that females regularly poach men to take up arms to fight for their causes, our list of allies grows thin. We do not have the strength to fight both Mordor and Isengard!

 

[Emba]

I find it enjoyable to "agree and amplify" any moronic concepts that I "used to" want to argue against.

It's like verbal shock therapy.

 

[uo89997]

Yup exactly. The only real way for someone's mind to change is if they personally experience something that contradicts their beliefs.

If some ugly virgin on IT who "worked on his personality" goes up to girls and gets rejected, he will change his beliefs pretty fast. Similarly, I used to believe heavily in the blackpill and that looks and height were the only determiners in dating. Then I went out and observed that dudes who were short and not that attractive were still able to bag mid-tier and sometimes high-tier chicks, so I tweaked my beliefs.

 

[uo89997]

Yeah I stopped arguing with people on the internet. It’s just a waste of my time.

This is why we don’t need a section to argue with normies and foids. It’s an exercise in futility

 

[Mulattocel]

I agree admincel

 

[InMemoriam]

Normies are under the scopes of feminazis, they don't dare making any non conformist moves or else they'd lose their heads (literally and figuratively)

 

[oldcel75]

They know the truth very well, so I'm not arguing to much, I just put two words: "Jeremy Meeks". Usually, it ends the argument.

 

[Deleted member 21770]

yup as that ex-kgb member said you can't change a demoralized person's belief but it works the same in this case

 

[idk125]

yeah i agree its like arguing with someone who is fully bluepilled

 

[Shrek]

If you want to change a persons mind, you need to target those that are on the fence about a subject. Someone that is more open to listening to new ideas is more likely to hear you out over the ideologue that has already made their mind up

And who can understand us (other than ourselves) ?

 

[Linesnap99]

The only viable solution is as in the past ie arranged marriages and men working hard enough to accumulate enough wealth to present to a girl’s father as a dowry (or however that’s spelled?) and thereby prove his worthiness as a provider.

thats bride price, dowry is when the hole pays the pole.

 

[cvh1991]

Ultimately it is a waste of time to convince someone of your position if they're deeply entrenched in their beliefs. For example, there is no need to argue with many people from IT on their beliefs because most of them are deeply entrenched in their beliefs about incels. Deeply held beliefs are hard to shake, and it is usually not worth engaging with someone that has deeply held beliefs as you are probably unlikely to change their mind.

If you want to change a persons mind, you need to target those that are on the fence about a subject. Someone that is more open to listening to new ideas is more likely to hear you out over the ideologue that has already made their mind up. This is why politicans cater to people that are more towards the center than on the fringes. Most people don't have extreme ideological beliefs, so most political campaigns target people that are more like to be swayed.

My point is that it is useless trying to sway someone that is extreme in their beliefs and/or are deeply entrenched in them. You are better off trying to convince someone that hasn't "taken a side" or has more moderate beliefs.

Sometimes I can get through to someone, but it usually requires a lot of careful effort, multiple attempts, and you have to be extremely well prepared with knock down citations to back up your claims in an air tight manner.

Obviously it’s not gonna be enough to say “this is what I’ve seen and experienced” but it’s a lot more convincing if you can say things like, “There’s a study from X reputable outlet that demonstrated Y”, things like that.

For example, a good starting point is getting people to understand the asymmetry between men and women when it comes to sex/dating and for that we can point to any number of online or speed dating statistics (or just how there isn’t really any demand for male prostitutes/women don’t simp and pay men for nudes and shit).

Now you are right that some people are entrenched and will never change, but rarely someone will or they’ll at least be forced to acknowledge some of your points. And that can’t happen unless they’re exploded to our ideas.

If it’s a woman you do definitely get into that territory of the age old quote “it is difficult to get a person to understand something when their own interests depend on their not understanding it”. Usually with women they just hop straight to the Ad Hominem in my experience, but what else is new.

The reason I fight you on this sort of is because our only hope for real change is to blackpill as many men as fucking possible and that requires that we have our ducks in a row on the debate/citation side and actually talk to people we know. You are right though that you gotta pick your battles carefully so I hear you.

 

[Firefly]

wonder what made master make this thread.

I would also like to know OP

 

[Master]

I would also like to know OP

Mostly Twitter lol.

 

[Rivened]

Sometimes I can get through to someone, but it usually requires a lot of careful effort, multiple attempts, and you have to be extremely well prepared with knock down citations to back up your claims in an air tight manner.

It's like being in the arctic and trying to sell an eskimo some ice.

It requires effort from both parts. I consider that it would be easier to be approached with these type of interests/ideas already in the mind of the other person instead of me being the one who brings the topics up when the other person probably didn't ask for such. But that approach is not the best in every instance.

 

[erenyeager]

[UWSL]I want lookism/blackpill to be false.[/UWSL]
[UWSL]But it won't make it false[/UWSL]

People are born evil this won't ever make it false

 

[TheProphetMuscle]

It’s still fun to poke holes in their arguments and watch them struggle to come up with counter arguments when you present them with facts

 

[manlet ricel]

wonder what made master make this thread.

big ed could be a chad if he is tall

 

[BrettyBoy]

Soys don't like hearing facts and many of them will probably never change.