Serious Whoever pretends that free-will is favourable to happiness has never been depressed

[ColdLightOfDay]

I would trade ‘free will’ for happiness in a heartbeat. The belief that we are the masters of our own minds as an excuse for why the world is such a terrible place and humans are such disgusting creatures does not add up in my book.

I actually don’t even believe in ‘free will’ per se, I consider the mind to be more like an algorithm which sustains the illusion of personal agency for the preservation of our ego and through it the preservation of our motivations. Because we are retarded and arrogant we call the conscious experience of this illusion ‘free will’ even though it is nothing more than a smokescreen.

Even if free will was real, I do not believe it has any inherent value if its subject is, as a consequence, forced to endure inordinate suffering. I would gladly trade it for a happier life.

 

[Hikikomori]

High IQ. I think anyone who's suffered hardcore, would trade the illusion for happiness or even just trade it to be content.

 

[Deleted member 2686]

tbh this

libertarian collectivism found in ethnic races such as curries, rice, jews and arabs has served them very well and has built stable lives(so long as they stray from these lives)

I call this libertarian, because it is not a result of a state, but is actually natural

compare this to Europeans, who have unstable families now as a result of free will beliefs now

 

[Robtical]

How do you know happiness isn't an illusion? If "free will" means not getting cucked by a used whore, then that's what I want.

 

[modus_coperandi]

I would prefer the kind of free will they have in brave new world with a caste system where every caste has their own limited predetermined desires and concept of happiness. So even gamma plus males can get their fair share of happiness.

Don't know why people still think it's some sort of dystopia.

 

[ColdLightOfDay]

How do you know happiness isn't an illusion? If "free will" means not getting cucked by a used whore, then that's what I want.

Happiness definitely is an illusion, all of our emotions are. Free will is just one of the most commonly used excuses for why we have to persevere suffering (also an illusion), and I’m just saying I don’t think this trade off is worth the pain.

 

[Robtical]

Happiness definitely is an illusion, all of our emotions are. Free will is just one of the most commonly used excuses for why we have to persevere suffering (also an illusion), and I’m just saying I don’t think this trade off is worth the pain.

I usually see people holding on to suffering for some little amount of happiness they get from it, and not maximizing their full free will.

 

[ColdLightOfDay]

I would prefer the kind of free will they have in brave new world with a caste system where every caste has their own limited predetermined desires and concept of happiness. So even gamma plus males can get their fair share of happiness.

Don't know why people still think it's some sort of dystopia.

I’m speaking about free-will in the cognitive sense, not the political one. It’s possible for a political system (like communism) to deny its subjects freedom, though they still retain their perceivable ‘free will’ to deny that society’s restrictions if they are willing to suffer the consequences.

 

[Nothingness]

Free will ...omg...what crass intellect can realy believe in free will.

 

[ColdLightOfDay]

I usually see people holding on to suffering for some little amount of happiness they get from it, and not maximizing their full free will.

This is partly why I don’t actually believe in the existence of free will, I don’t think mankind is consciously capable of deciding whether he is holding onto his suffering or not, unless he has mastered meditation to the point where he is essentially a Buddhist monk.

 

[Nothingness]

This is partly why I don’t actually believe in the existence of free will, I don’t think mankind is consciously capable of deciding whether he is holding onto his suffering or not, unless he has mastered meditation to the point where he is essentially a Buddhist monk.

I think the act of free will would always equal to suicide

 

[Robtical]

This is partly why I don’t actually believe in the existence of free will, I don’t think mankind is consciously capable of deciding whether he is holding onto his suffering or not, unless he has mastered meditation to the point where he is essentially a Buddhist monk.

I'm too attached to some things to completely let go of them, I think the best thing is to have balance.

 

[modus_coperandi]

I’m speaking about free-will in the cognitive sense, not the political one. It’s possible for a political system (like communism) to deny its subjects freedom, though they still retain their perceivable ‘free will’ to deny that society’s restrictions if they are willing to suffer the consequences.

Yeah I know what you meant. But in the book all the desires and the "will" of the individuals from a certain caste are genetically modified so they can't transcend their predetermined concept of happiness. They can't possibly know about the freedom they're missing out on.

 

[ColdLightOfDay]

I'm too attached to some things to completely let go of them

Like what?

I think the best thing is to have balance.

Probably, this is the case with most things.

 

[Deleted member 8884]

I wish I could take the blue pill again (srs). I'm literally going to turn into Cypher from the first matrix. The black pill has raped my life. I want everyone on this site to hate me (ded srs)

 

[Deleted member 17724]

tbh this

libertarian collectivism found in ethnic races such as curries, rice, jews and arabs has served them very well and has built stable lives(so long as they stray from these lives)

I call this libertarian, because it is not a result of a state, but is actually natural

compare this to Europeans, who have unstable families now as a result of free will beliefs now

I always thought it was weird how whites were seemingly the only race (maybe together with some subgroups of blacks) that did not have a tightly-knit tribalist system. Even before jews gained full control over their countries, they've always seen themselves as individuals first and the group as a very secondary thing.
Even though I'm not really religious, my moral system still coincides with Islamic morals and I observe something similar with other non-religious ethnics. But whites have seemingly no limits on how degenerate they can be and go all out. even if they say that they belong to a religious group.

 

[LittleDarkAge]

I would prefer the kind of free will they have in brave new world with a caste system where every caste has their own limited predetermined desires and concept of happiness. So even gamma plus males can get their fair share of happiness.

Don't know why people still think it's some sort of dystopia.

Would prefer the society in a Brave New World to the one we currently live in. There were no incels in that society

 

[ColdLightOfDay]

Yeah I know what you meant. But in the book all the desires and the "will" of the individuals from a certain caste are genetically modified so they can't transcend their predetermined concept of happiness. They can't possibly know about the freedom they're missing out on.

Ah I see, I should read it again. I was a teenager when I went through it last, I don’t remember much other than that I thoroughly enjoyed it.

 

[Robtical]

Like what?

My pets, belongings, healthy food, exercise, the ability to stay healthy, and the internet. I'm also not willing to sacrifice my dignity by betabuxxing a used rostie and letting her dress the way she wants and keep her phone private.

 

[Deleted member 2686]

I always thought it was weird how whites were seemingly the only race (maybe together with some subgroups of blacks) that did not have a tightly-knit tribalist system. Even before jews gained full control over their countries, they've always seen themselves as individuals first and the group as a very secondary thing.
Even though I'm not really religious, my moral system still coincides with Islamic morals and I observe something similar with other non-religious ethnics. But whites have seemingly no limits on how degenerate they can be and go all out. even if they say that they belong to a religious group.

Tbh

I think enlightenment and after was when individualism started to reach white people

pre enlightenment(even renaissance times)white people were more or less the same amount of tribalist as other groups were

 

[Deleted member 17724]

Tbh

I think enlightenment and after was when individualism started to reach white people

pre enlightenment(even renaissance times)white people were more or less the same amount of tribalist as other groups were

High IQ. But that still makes you wonder; why did the enlightement occur among white people while its ideas were mostly rejected by the rest of the world? You could say it's about IQ or wealth but East-Asians still have strong collectivist societies and respect for ancient traditions.

 

[BlkPillPres]

How do you know happiness isn't an illusion? If "free will" means not getting cucked by a used whore, then that's what I want.

I'd argue free will is what actually exists and its happiness that is the illusion

HAPPINESS:
Happiness is subjective, it is rarely if ever truly attained because its standard is determined by the beliefs and mindset of the person chasing after it, it is dictated by two variables (Personal Standards and/or Ignorance of Standards). There are people out there in life whose lives are complete shit in comparison to ours in terms of standards of living, but they are "happier" than us, and they want to keep living while we feel suicidal, and that's because of:

1. Personal Standards - Their standards for existence are low, they don't want for much, could be because they'd suffered so much in life before that the meager pleasures they have now are enough in comparison to the past, could be because they have low self esteem and consider what they currently have "enough for someone like me", at the end of the day, they are "happy" based on the standards of living they have for their own life.

2. Ignorance of Standards - They are unaware of how much better their standards of living could be (e.g. someone born in some remote/tribal village/community with barely any technology). For example someone born in an amish community and is never exposed to any technology or modern media, or someone born in a monastery in some mountain in china and they have never left that community. They likely feel more satisfied and fulfilled with life than we ever will, but that's simply because they don't know what they are missing out on. If a 10/10 stacy walked up into said monastery in a bikini and an Ipad with a movie playing on it, that same guy who had "discovered nirvana" (a state of perfect happiness and enlightenment) would lose his shit and that would throw his peace out the window, he'll now realize many things he wanted deep down that he wasn't even truly aware of, entertainment, to have his lust satiated rather than repressed and controlled, etc.

The Amish are a better example of this, they have this rite of passage called Rumspringa,

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rumspringa

A lot of amish youths after going through this period never return to their communities because they now know the life they are missing out on, the phrase "ignorance is bliss" means "ignorance is happiness", its part of happiness, not knowing what you're missing out on allows you to set lower standards for happiness, and the mere introduction of those things into your consciousness destroys any peace of mind you had, your happiness is now sub par because you know your life could be more enjoyable now.

You can cope and deny all you want at that point, but you'll always know deep down its true.

Happiness is based on the limitations one places on themselves (ego, goals, etc) and the limitations that life placed on them (birth place, physical/mental disabilities, etc)

That's why I don't aspire to be "happy", I aspire to be "physically satisfied" and "stress free", that criteria is much more objective than "being happy", because talk to the average person who says they are "happy" and they live stressful and problematic lives, and that's because their personal standards for themselves revolves around "facing challenges", so they never stop chasing after more stresses in life, and they are always stuck wondering why they never feel "truly satisfied". Its because they are playing the game wrong, life isn't an endless series of achievements to be met, and that's the mindset (((they))) have indoctrinated onto the masses to keep us "happy and busy worker drones" while they actually enjoy what a fulfilling life is aboue (peace and prosperity).

 

[Robtical]

I'd argue free will is what actually exists and its happiness that is the illusion

Happiness is a state of mind, freedom is your ability to do things without getting stopped or cucked.

 

[BlkPillPres]

Happiness is a state of mind, freedom is your ability to do things without getting stopped or cucked.

Exactly

Freedom is something you can actually do and it isn't subjective, it can objectively defined, whereas happiness is vague, subjective and differs from person to person, for example there are millionaires that have commited suicide and there's some poor farmer in a crappy country that is happy because he has a wife and children that he can barely provide for and they "give him reason to keep living", happiness is arbitrary because anyone can be happier than you for any reason even if their life is objectively worse than yours, and someone can be less happy than you even if their life is objectively better, because happiness revolves around subjectivity, its all about ones personal perspective, its not a dependable criteria for making choices in life.

Choosing something because just because it makes you happy is no different than women jumping from bad boy to bad boy because "bad boys" give them "the tingles" knowing full well said "bad boy" is just going to treat them like shit, happiness is a dangerous illusion that can lead you to make self detrimental choices.

@ColdLightOfDay - Keep in mind, there are literal cucks out here that are genuinely happier than you, so are you saying you'd choose to be a literal cuck over being an incel?

Happiness is to subjective a criteria to base life choices around, its illogical, someone can be happier than you even whilst having a worse life, because they have different criteria for happiness than you do

 

[seija]

Theres no free will anymore once you've taken the blackpill.

 

[Deleted member 8353]

I actually don’t even believe in ‘free will’ per se, I consider the mind to be more like an algorithm which sustains the illusion of personal agency for the preservation of our ego and through it the preservation of our motivations. Because we are retarded and arrogant we call the conscious experience of this illusion ‘free will’ even though it is nothing more than a smokescreen.

True, belief in free will(at least as most people understand it) is essentially required for our full range of functioning. Hence why Lerner referred to belief in a just world as a "fundamental delusion", as without that delusion much of our motivations evaporate. The problem, of course, is that people who hold this delusion are varying degrees of unwilling to accept that other people truly can be victims of unfortunate circumstances(along with their own nature).

 

[Deleted member 1252]

High IQ

Free will is an illusion, and happiness (zen, nirvana, etc) is the only goal of life.

 

[Robtical]

Happiness is to subjective a criteria to base life choices around, its illogical, someone can be happier than you even whilst having a worse life, because they have different criteria for happiness than you do

I think most depression comes from the absence of freedom to do something, whether it's your ability to have sex with many women, or having a job you enjoy and make a lot of money from, being granted access to something/somewhere, or having the energy to jog 10 miles with no breaks. You can never be happier by having less freedoms, but less freedom will usually make you less happy, especially if the freedom lost is one you enjoy partaking in.