Should Danzo have been the main villain?

[Pikacel]

Ok this is probably inaccurate because I didn’t finish Shippuden.

So the eyes of the massacred Uchiha were collected by Danzo + Obito and the Uchiha were hated because of previous conflicts with them + Curse of Hatred. Why not just make the Curse of Hatred a myth fabricated out of fear/prejudice? Did the Uchiha HAVE to be inherently aggressive and unstable? It’s not like the genocide is justifiable either way, Curse of Hatred being a myth would’ve been more sinister IMO

Also Obito is a fag, Danzo should’ve been the sole orchestrator of the Uchiha clan downfall and collected all of the Sharingan for his Konoha’s use. Also Sasuke killed him way too easily. It’s as if he was too problematic so they had to get rid of him and replace him with generic megalomaniac badguy (Madara). Madara could’ve still been a final villain but damn Danzo seems like wasted potential.

He’s also a ‘ninja’ villain, having spearheaded actual covert operations and shit rather than solely being a super saiyan wizard. He also would’ve forced Naruto and co to face some nasty truths, that being Hokage isn’t like that and you’re just a figurehead watching the real leaders like Danzo do the sick fucked up dirty work while you larp as a good noble leader. Villains like Obito and Madara are way too easy to confront in comparison, basically feelgood scapegoats.

Madara still has aura and could’ve been like a ceremonial final boss to wrap up the lore/worldbuilding rather than have him preside over a whole arc

 

[BurntIvoryKingcel]

I hope I didn't contribute to the Naruto brigade of the Anime & Manga section with my Naruto villain post kek.

 

[KillNiggers]

If Naruto was a political anime then Danzo would be the main villain but sadly it's a shonen.

 

[poorenglishcel]

Danzo was the main hero

 

[bruhwtf]

He's not as bullshit op as the 3 biggest cocksuckers in Naruto. The series would've been more interesting if danzo was the main big guy.

 

[D. B. Gooner]

Ok this is probably inaccurate because I didn’t finish Shippuden.

So the eyes of the massacred Uchiha were collected by Danzo + Obito and the Uchiha were hated because of previous conflicts with them + Curse of Hatred. Why not just make the Curse of Hatred a myth fabricated out of fear/prejudice? Did the Uchiha HAVE to be inherently aggressive and unstable? It’s not like the genocide is justifiable either way, Curse of Hatred being a myth would’ve been more sinister IMO

Also Obito is a fag, Danzo should’ve been the sole orchestrator of the Uchiha clan downfall and collected all of the Sharingan for his Konoha’s use. Also Sasuke killed him way too easily. It’s as if he was too problematic so they had to get rid of him and replace him with generic megalomaniac badguy (Madara). Madara could’ve still been a final villain but damn Danzo seems like wasted potential.

He’s also a ‘ninja’ villain, having spearheaded actual covert operations and shit rather than solely being a super saiyan wizard. He also would’ve forced Naruto and co to face some nasty truths, that being Hokage isn’t like that and you’re just a figurehead watching the real leaders like Danzo do the sick fucked up dirty work while you larp as a good noble leader. Villains like Obito and Madara are way too easy to confront in comparison, basically feelgood scapegoats.

Madara still has aura and could’ve been like a ceremonial final boss to wrap up the lore/worldbuilding rather than have him preside over a whole arc

The curse of hatred was actually a myth, the uchiha are just generally more emotional, they love more than any other people, so when their loved ones die, they begin to hate more than anybody else.

Danzo simply wasn't enough of a foil to naruto like obito or sasuke were for him to be the main antagonist. Danzo also didn't work with Obito, I'm sure he was aware he helped itachi out, but ultimately he was a third party who was only in it to gain some new sharingan.

I don't feel like Obito is an easy character to confront, Naruto could have simply separated the title Hokage from Danzo, just because Danzo is the hokage doesn't mean he muddied the hokage name. Especially since both of Naruto's parents' dreams were also to become hokage, how could he ever hate that title. After all Naruto didn't want to be hokage because he admired them, he wanted recognition from the village first and foremost. Obito on the other hand, is the guy who had the same dream and personality as naruto, whose sensei was narutos father. Naruto's whole newfound "stopping the cycle of hatred" ideology wouldn't work if he couldn't even confront the guy who was the biggest foil for him, despite the fact that Obito killed his parents and made his life hell.

Now just because you disagree with something doesn't mean it shouldn't happen in the story. I, for an example think the concept of the village is retarded, I was rooting for Sasuke to destroy the Leaf and reform the Uchiha clan by himself, but I'm not going to hate Naruto because he wants to be hokage.

I think madara is kind of mediocre as far as naruto antagonists go, I think obito does everything he does but better (Except for "aura" and competence). He's still alright but the naruto antagonist cast is so stacked and yet when people think of Naruto villains Madara is the first one that comes to mind. I think obito, sasuke, itach and pain are all better than him.

 

[Pikacel]

The curse of hatred was actually a myth, the uchiha are just generally more emotional, they love more than any other people, so when their loved ones die, they begin to hate more than anybody else.

Danzo simply wasn't enough of a foil to naruto like obito or sasuke were for him to be the main antagonist. Danzo also didn't work with Obito, I'm sure he was aware he helped itachi out, but ultimately he was a third party who was only in it to gain some new sharingan.

I don't feel like Obito is an easy character to confront, Naruto could have simply separated the title Hokage from Danzo, just because Danzo is the hokage doesn't mean he muddied the hokage name. Especially since both of Naruto's parents' dreams were also to become hokage, how could he ever hate that title. After all Naruto didn't want to be hokage because he admired them, he wanted recognition from the village first and foremost. Obito on the other hand, is the guy who had the same dream and personality as naruto, whose sensei was narutos father. Naruto's whole newfound "stopping the cycle of hatred" ideology wouldn't work if he couldn't even confront the guy who was the biggest foil for him, despite the fact that Obito killed his parents and made his life hell.

Now just because you disagree with something doesn't mean it shouldn't happen in the story. I, for an example think the concept of the village is retarded, I was rooting for Sasuke to destroy the Leaf and reform the Uchiha clan by himself, but I'm not going to hate Naruto because he wants to be hokage.

I think madara is kind of mediocre as far as naruto antagonists go, I think obito does everything he does but better (Except for "aura" and competence). He's still alright but the naruto antagonist cast is so stacked and yet when people think of Naruto villains Madara is the first one that comes to mind. I think obito, sasuke, itach and pain are all better than him.

Hmm, Naruto already had Gaara as a compelling foil though. Seems repetitive to give him another foil, at some point they need to introduce a new conflict other than ‘we both suffered so we’re basically the same’. And just separating the Hokage from Danzo seems like sweeping it under the rug, he should’ve acknowledged Hiruzen’s inability to control Danzo and learned that he can easily allow atrocities to happen if he isn’t capable of controlling shit. Not even saying he should hate the role of Hokage but part of maturing should involve understanding that becoming a great Hokage and ending the cycle of hatred isn’t as easy as talk no jutsuing the victims of said cycle or stating empty words/promises. And tbh Pain and Obito are kinda just generic villains, Sasuke is way harder to deal with. I didn’t keep up with fourth shinobi world war but it seems like they converted Sasuke into a villain instead of keeping him grey/anti hero. IMO it’s a copout to ascribe the cycle of hatred to 1d villain strawmen only instead of conflicted human characters.

And even if Danzo is put aside in favour of foil-like antagonists or antagonists representing the cycle of hatred Naruto should still be tested with the responsibility of Hokage. And instead of making the series maturer focusing on the political conflicts involved with managing a hidden village Kishimoto reverted back to 12 yo fanbase with Boruto only the writing is way worse than it’s pre-timeskip Naruto predecessor. So there’s never a real opportunity for Naruto to be challenged in that way. It’s way too easy.

 

[D. B. Gooner]

Hmm, Naruto already had Gaara as a compelling foil though. Seems repetitive to give him another foil, at some point they need to introduce a new conflict other than ‘we both suffered so we’re basically the same’. And just separating the Hokage from Danzo seems like sweeping it under the rug, he should’ve acknowledged Hiruzen’s inability to control Danzo and learned that he can easily allow atrocities to happen if he isn’t capable of controlling shit. Not even saying he should hate the role of Hokage but part of maturing should involve understanding that becoming a great Hokage and ending the cycle of hatred isn’t as easy as talk no jutsuing the victims of said cycle or stating empty words/promises. And tbh Pain and Obito are kinda just generic villains, Sasuke is way harder to deal with. I didn’t keep up with fourth shinobi world war but it seems like they converted Sasuke into a villain instead of keeping him grey/anti hero. IMO it’s a copout to ascribe the cycle of hatred to 1d villain strawmen only instead of conflicted human characters.

And even if Danzo is put aside in favour of foil-like antagonists or antagonists representing the cycle of hatred Naruto should still be tested with the responsibility of Hokage. And instead of making the series maturer focusing on the political conflicts involved with managing a hidden village Kishimoto reverted back to 12 yo fanbase with Boruto only the writing is way worse than it’s pre-timeskip Naruto predecessor. So there’s never a real opportunity for Naruto to be challenged in that way. It’s way too easy.

I just think it would have been way easier for naruto to kill nagato/obito/sasuke rather than attempting to change them and he had chances to do so. Sasuke wasn't 1d he inherited itachi's way of living and tried to apply it on a more global scale, he was going to kill every kage, naruto and tailed beast and unify the world by making them all globally hate him, kind of like itachi saved the leaf by eliminating their thread and being painted as a traitor, unifying the leaf in their hatred of himself. It was the logical next step for his character, he has always been chasing itachi, even before the massacre when their dad made him develop an inferiority coplex towards his brother. Itachi's actions made him an avenger, Itachi's sacrifice gave him his ideology. Also I feel like nagato, obito and sasuke are pretty grey, I mean at least I was rooting for them. As far as them being generic, they are a blueprint for that type of villain, though I'm not that deep into anime so if there have been a lot of similar villains that predate pain, I haven't heard of them.

 

[Pikacel]

I just think it would have been way easier for naruto to kill nagato/obito/sasuke rather than attempting to change them and he had chances to do so. Sasuke wasn't 1d he inherited itachi's way of living and tried to apply it on a more global scale, he was going to kill every kage, naruto and tailed beast and unify the world by making them all globally hate him, kind of like itachi saved the leaf by eliminating their thread and being painted as a traitor, unifying the leaf in their hatred of himself. It was the logical next step for his character, he has always been chasing itachi, even before the massacre when their dad made him develop an inferiority coplex towards his brother. Itachi's actions made him an avenger, Itachi's sacrifice gave him his ideology. Also I feel like nagato, obito and sasuke are pretty grey, I mean at least I was rooting for them. As far as them being generic, they are a blueprint for that type of villain, though I'm not that deep into anime so if there have been a lot of similar villains that predate pain, I haven't heard of them.

Idk but with the reveal that Danzo and Konoha forced Itachi to commit the massacre and take the blame rather than it being Itachi's own conviction, why would Sasuke want to be seen as a villain and be used as a scapegoat to push all accountability towards just like Itachi? PLus if he wanted to destroy the ninja system wouldn't it make sense to sully and expose the name of the kage, make jinchuriki out to be subhuman demons and build a movement of sorts. Because with that approach I'd imagine people would look back and see the supposed benefits of hidden ninja villages, despise Sasuke for ruining everything then try to restore it. At least the tailed beast WMDs would be gone but the system of child soldiers and slaughtering innocents because they hold dangerous kekkei genkai can still reemerge. Would be way more effective if Sasuke is posthumously worshipped as a hero or prophet who carried out righteous judgement on the wicked corrupt ninja.

Pain is alright but he's like what you expect from the leader of a shadowy organisation; has big plans, a dark worldview kills the mentor is a big threat that forces Naruto to rise up and defeat him. It's something I see more in video games, they tend to have area bosses (individual Akatsuki members) that build up to one final boss with an epic plan. Meanwhile Obito is like Krelian or Grahf from Xenogears; carried out a billion atrocities because his oneitis died. IMO having good motivations or reasons doesn't make you grey, when you kill innocents on that scale even if it's for the greater good (which you won't necessarily accomplish) it’s still some fuckery.


Not calling Sasuke 1d, but he should’ve been an anti-hero instead of a villain. His perspective is important and the ninja system is shown to have a lot of issues especially with kekkei genkai pogroms (Haku experienced it, Uchiha downfall) and fking Danzo. Instead of just having Naruto be the hero and Sasuke a villain it should be idealistic good vs a more pragmatic good where both perspectives have value IMO