Discussion If I made an inky self-defense program, who would be interested?

[JudeoBiden]

I'm thinking of making a self-defense program to equip my brocels with the easiest, most effective moves, and a very simple but effective game plan. The big defect will be that you can't do defensive drills or sparring alone, but I've got a next-best-thing solution to that.

 

[Cryotron]

carry a pepper spray at least

 

[JudeoBiden]

carry a pepper spray at least

This is what I'm trying to save you from. Pepper spray sucks. You have to reach for it, which opens you up, and you will be breathing it in, too. Pepper gel doesn't pollute the air, but you have to hit them with it or it does nothing. Knives and guns get you put in prison, don't even bring those up, it's insanely difficult to legally justify killing an unarmed person.

99% of people out there can't fight for their lives, but they think they can. The most common are the haymaker guy, who just throws haymakers as hard as he can, and the football player, who will tackle you. If you know how to deal with both of these, you're not going to lose to anyone who isn't trained.

 

[Cryotron]

This is what I'm trying to save you from. Pepper spray sucks. You have to reach for it, which opens you up, and you will be breathing it in, too. Pepper gel doesn't pollute the air, but you have to hit them with it or it does nothing. Knives and guns get you put in prison, don't even bring those up, it's insanely difficult to legally justify killing an unarmed person.

99% of people out there can't fight for their lives, but they think they can. The most common are the haymaker guy, who just throws haymakers as hard as he can, and the football player, who will tackle you. If you know how to deal with both of these, you're not going to lose to anyone who isn't trained.

i have no access to guns so it's the only option i have. Martial arts are only a option for physically fit people (you can still get stabbed or smth)

 

[JudeoBiden]

you can still get stabbed or smth

Not worth mentioning, there's pretty much no defense against that. If someone reaches into a pocket, either run away or take control of their arm right away.

 

[Cryotron]

Not worth mentioning, there's pretty much no defense against that. If someone reaches into a pocket, either run away or take control of their arm right away.

i envy americans, at least you can get a simple pistol so you have something to defend yourself

 

[greggymex7]

Only based thing abt jewsa is u can shoot niggers who try to stab u

 

[JudeoBiden]

i envy americans, at least you can get a simple pistol so you have something to defend yourself

Guns are pretty shit for self-defense. Against a knife attack, they have to be at least 21 feet away for you to have a good chance. Otherwise, they just make you into the criminal. "An armed society is a polite society" is a whopper of a myth, I've lived in places where it's legal to own and carry guns, people are exactly as shitty.

 

[Cryotron]

Guns are pretty shit for self-defense. Against a knife attack, they have to be at least 21 feet away for you to have a good chance. Otherwise, they just make you into the criminal. "An armed society is a polite society" is a whopper of a myth, I've lived in places where it's legal to own and carry guns, people are exactly as shitty.

still better option than pepper spray

 

[JudeoBiden]

Alright let's just do it, then. Program sketch:

Elbow strikes
We're not going to be punching. This is because people without training suck ass at punching. I can't teach you to punch well and keep your defenses up over text, so we're going to replace it with a much safer moveset: elbow strikes.

Elbow strikes are great because they happen at close range, where even many trained fighters are deficient. Elbows, the body part, are also what you put in the way of your opponent's attacks to protect your head, and elbow strikes cause you to naturally do that.

This video demonstrates 2 of our elbows:
View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/rl8Kf80_Co8

This video demonstrates 3 of our elbows:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouDc9hCHrBs


1. Up elbow
This is the third technique in the first video, he calls it the uppercut.
This is the third technique in the second video.

This targets the head in a similar way to an uppercut, requiring the opponent to react in order to defend.

2. Horizontal elbow
This is the first technique in the first video.
This is the second technique in the second video.

This targets the head in a similar way to a hook punch, requiring the opponent to react in order to defend.

3. Elbow thrust
This is the fourth technique in the second video.

This is a variation of the up elbow where you step in so your elbow collides with your opponent. The power is entirely from stepping in. Use this to get into elbowing range, and to chase a passive or retreating opponent.

Kicks
Kicks out-range and out-power punches, and you can kick while keeping your hands up to protect your head. This will make life very difficult for a boxer who tries to fight you.

1. Push kick

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wBQs-l7yss


This is a space maker. You can use it to push an approaching opponent away, to push a close opponent away, or to push yourself away from your opponent. It gives you a way to reset in case you're getting the shitty end of the stick up close, and it will frustrate them and make them want to come in closer where your elbows will be in range.

In the video, you'll see he is targeting just below the ribs. You probably can't do that easily, or at all. Instead, I want you to target your opponent's knee. The knees are a very good target because it causes the opponent to get off-balance, or it can hyperextend their knee. Once they've taken one of these, they're not going to want more!

Game Plan
The up elbow and horizontal elbow require different defenses. This means that you can overwhelm someone by alternating them, getting them stuck in a defensive loop. That's exactly our game plan, once you're in, let those elbows fly.

But, if your opponent isn't even trying to block you, just throw up elbows. They protect the side of your head from haymakers, and if they're not blocking, it's probably because they're swinging.

So, the overall game plan is to to elbow thrust your way into clinch range, up elbow them until they start blocking, then horizontal elbow them until they adjust their block, then up elbow again, and so on. If they got the initiative on you somehow and you're on the defensive, then step back and use a push kick to reset, and start over.

 

[Adolf Kitler]

carry a firearm at least

 

[Adolf Kitler]

Guns are pretty shit for self-defense. Against a knife attack, they have to be at least 21 feet away for you to have a good chance.

wouldn't that depend on your draw time

 

[kay']

Dnr

 

[coping_manlet]

Get a gun. Only solution for when niggers pull up on you to rob you

 

[Robb97]

Alright let's just do it, then. Program sketch:

Elbow strikes
We're not going to be punching. This is because people without training suck ass at punching. I can't teach you to punch well and keep your defenses up over text, so we're going to replace it with a much safer moveset: elbow strikes.

Elbow strikes are great because they happen at close range, where even many trained fighters are deficient. Elbows, the body part, are also what you put in the way of your opponent's attacks to protect your head, and elbow strikes cause you to naturally do that.

This video demonstrates 2 of our elbows:
View: https://www.youtube.com/shorts/rl8Kf80_Co8

This video demonstrates 3 of our elbows:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ouDc9hCHrBs


1. Up elbow
This is the third technique in the first video, he calls it the uppercut.
This is the third technique in the second video.

This targets the head in a similar way to an uppercut, requiring the opponent to react in order to defend.

2. Horizontal elbow
This is the first technique in the first video.
This is the second technique in the second video.

This targets the head in a similar way to a hook punch, requiring the opponent to react in order to defend.

3. Elbow thrust
This is the fourth technique in the second video.

This is a variation of the up elbow where you step in so your elbow collides with your opponent. The power is entirely from stepping in. Use this to get into elbowing range, and to chase a passive or retreating opponent.

Kicks
Kicks out-range and out-power punches, and you can kick while keeping your hands up to protect your head. This will make life very difficult for a boxer who tries to fight you.

1. Push kick

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5wBQs-l7yss


This is a space maker. You can use it to push an approaching opponent away, to push a close opponent away, or to push yourself away from your opponent. It gives you a way to reset in case you're getting the shitty end of the stick up close, and it will frustrate them and make them want to come in closer where your elbows will be in range.

In the video, you'll see he is targeting just below the ribs. You probably can't do that easily, or at all. Instead, I want you to target your opponent's knee. The knees are a very good target because it causes the opponent to get off-balance, or it can hyperextend their knee. Once they've taken one of these, they're not going to want more!

Game Plan
The up elbow and horizontal elbow require different defenses. This means that you can overwhelm someone by alternating them, getting them stuck in a defensive loop. That's exactly our game plan, once you're in, let those elbows fly.

But, if your opponent isn't even trying to block you, just throw up elbows. They protect the side of your head from haymakers, and if they're not blocking, it's probably because they're swinging.

So, the overall game plan is to to elbow thrust your way into clinch range, up elbow them until they start blocking, then horizontal elbow them until they adjust their block, then up elbow again, and so on. If they got the initiative on you somehow and you're on the defensive, then step back and use a push kick to reset, and start over.

Great stuff. My plan is to use a flashlight in my left hand and a steel whip in my right hand. Steel whips are technically legal in most places if the ends are not reinforced.

The basic idea is to flash the attackers so they have impaired vision, then isolate one attacker and strike them across the head which might kill him or leave him badly wounded. Then repeat the same thing with the rest of them. If they don't look that serious, then strike their arms and legs first to see if that will deter them.
Some of them might carry a knife, but the reach of the whip is superior. I think the whip is generally the better weapon for self defense.

One big draw back of the whip is the fact that a thick jacket can dampen the impact a lot. So if the attackers wear jackets with their hood up, the strikes won't be as powerful, even the ones to the head.
If there is time, one could build a quick mechanism to assemble the whip into a club with the reinforced top and then later disassemble it. A 50cm long whip with a steel ball at one end would deal a lot of damage even through a thick winter jacket. But this would only be done in an extreme scenario.

In a one-on-one situation without weapons I would prefer a quick takedown and then use juijitsu to submit them because that won't get you into prison and it's a skill that can be trained. Striking seems harder to train. Some people are just gentically better at striking than others.

 

[JudeoBiden]

Great stuff. My plan is to use a flashlight in my left hand and a steel whip in my right hand. Steel whips are technically legal in most places if the ends are not reinforced.

Flashlights are insanely underrated in nighttime scenarios. A flashlight even beats a gun at night, because the gun is only as good as the shooter's aim.

In a one-on-one situation without weapons I would prefer a quick takedown and then use juijitsu to submit them because that won't get you into prison and it's a skill that can be trained. Striking seems harder to train. Some people are just gentically better at striking than others.

You've got it backwards. Striking is way, way easier to get proficient at than BJJ. It takes 10 years of effective training to be a BJJ black belt. It takes 2 years of effective training to reach a comparable level in striking.

 

[Robb97]

Flashlights are insanely underrated in nighttime scenarios. A flashlight even beats a gun at night, because the gun is only as good as the shooter's aim.

You've got it backwards. Striking is way, way easier to get proficient at than BJJ. It takes 10 years of effective training to be a BJJ black belt. It takes 2 years of effective training to reach a comparable level in striking.

What I meant is that grappling is a skill that you can practice no matter your genetics. If you put in the work chances are high that you will get good at it. Even if it takes a lot of work.
But with striking it seems like some people just don't have what it takes. A smaller guy with a glass jaw can train for 10 years and might still get knocked out by a drunk guy who just got lucky.
And it is way easier to actually know your level of grappling vs striking because you can go all out without risking serious injury and you can do that often. For striking on the other hand you always have to hold back when you're sparring with another person.

 

[JudeoBiden]

What I meant is that grappling is a skill that you can practice no matter your genetics. If you put in the work chances are high that you will get good at it. Even if it takes a lot of work.
But with striking it seems like some people just don't have what it takes. A smaller guy with a glass jaw can train for 10 years and might still get knocked out by a drunk guy who just got lucky.
And it is way easier to actually know your level of grappling vs striking because you can go all out without risking serious injury and you can do that often. For striking on the other hand you always have to hold back when you're sparring with another person.

Not one of these things is true.

Size and strength matter a lot in grappling. Technique matters more, but they still matter a lot. You're overly focused on genetics, no matter what your genetics, you must know how to fight to the best of your ability. So there is no point in mentioning them or factoring them into your decision.

It's called a puncher's chance, every fight has a small chance of going to the underdog, even if he can't fight his way out of a paper bag. Doesn't matter if it's striking or grappling. The constitution of your jaw is not the point if you're defending, you're not supposed to be eating hits in the first place. I'd rather be the guy with a glass jaw and good defense than the guy with an iron jaw who doesn't keep his hands up.

You can't go all-out when grappling, you will cripple each other. Grappling arts are incredibly conscious of keeping things light, giving people a chance to tap, and taking your L and tapping.

I'm not trying to talk you out of learning BJJ, I think you absolutely should. But you're going to have to ditch the myths. There are a lot of BJJ practitioners who don't know take-downs and don't know striking, and they basically can't fight outside of a controlled environment where people only wrestle.

 

[Robb97]

Not one of these things is true.

Size and strength matter a lot in grappling. Technique matters more, but they still matter a lot. You're overly focused on genetics, no matter what your genetics, you must know how to fight to the best of your ability. So there is no point in mentioning them or factoring them into your decision.

It's called a puncher's chance, every fight has a small chance of going to the underdog, even if he can't fight his way out of a paper bag. Doesn't matter if it's striking or grappling. The constitution of your jaw is not the point if you're defending, you're not supposed to be eating hits in the first place. I'd rather be the guy with a glass jaw and good defense than the guy with an iron jaw who doesn't keep his hands up.

You can't go all-out when grappling, you will cripple each other. Grappling arts are incredibly conscious of keeping things light, giving people a chance to tap, and taking your L and tapping.

I'm not trying to talk you out of learning BJJ, I think you absolutely should. But you're going to have to ditch the myths. There are a lot of BJJ practitioners who don't know take-downs and don't know striking, and they basically can't fight outside of a controlled environment where people only wrestle.

There are tournaments in wrestling and BJJ. The people who are competing generally go there with the objective to win. I doubt many of them want to keep it light. Especially in mma sometimes the ref stops the fight after a choke hold. The person who got choked gets released and happens to be unconscious. I get that at the lower levels people will tap sooner because there is less on the line, but I still think that tournaments are a good way to determine your level of proficiency.
On the other hand, in any serious fight that involves striking the loser usually walks away with a lot more injuries.

 

[JudeoBiden]

There are tournaments in wrestling and BJJ. The people who are competing generally go there with the objective to win. I doubt many of them want to keep it light. Especially in mma sometimes the ref stops the fight after a choke hold. The person who got choked gets released and happens to be unconscious.

As a rule, competitive fighting is at full force, and carries the risk of permanent serious injury. People have died in competitive striking. People have gotten paralyzed from the neck down in competitive wrestling. Watch a BJJ injury compilation sometime.

I get that at the lower levels people will tap sooner because there is less on the line,

IN TRAINING you tap soon because it's not worth being crippled to save your ego. In competition, you tap when you know you can't escape, because it's not worth being crippled to save your ego. In a professional fight with money on the line, you tap because the rest of your career is worth more than the prize money for that fight.

but I still think that tournaments are a good way to determine your level of proficiency.

Of course they are. Do you think tournaments are unique to BJJ? Every respectable martial art has a competitive scene.

On the other hand, in any serious fight that involves striking the loser usually walks away with a lot more injuries.

What are you even talking about at this point? That sounds like a selling point for striking. You're trying to hurt the guy who's attacking you, aren't you? Are you imagining that being a BJJ guy will make him not strike you? So many BJJ-only guys get wrecked because they get into a fight only to find out that fights don't start with a fist bump and pulling guard.

I'll repeat what I told you before: train BJJ. BJJ is great. But you still have to know striking. And you have to know takedowns. Strikers who can't grapple get fucked by grappling. Grapplers who can't strike get fucked by striking. You can't pick one, you need both.