Serious Could Hitler even win?

[Seahorsecel]

Despite slaying over 8 million soviet men (and injuring many more) the red army actually grew overall. From my understanding, the Duce also made questionable decisions in north Africa (125,000 Italians encircled by 35,000 Brits) and Greece which forced the Germans to intervene.

I'm not even sure if Hitler could invade Britain, you see the German navy wasn't exactly great. Their ships had many design flaws like:

Distributed armour scheme unheard of since USS Nevada (1914!) instead of the newer, all-or-nothing armour scheme. (all armour on the important bits, paper thin everywhere else)

Massively oversized guns that didn't allow for triple barrels

Oversized ships: German ships were generally much heavier compared to allied vessels but didn't offer much competitive edge (admiral hipper class comes to mind)

15" guns that was only a sidegrade to the WW1 era British 15" despite being around 30 years newer

Prioritizing Plan Z instead of building U-boats

And many more...

Air force I'm not an expert, but from what I've read the Brits shot down much more planes than the Germans during the battle of Britain.

@DarkStarDown
@MoggedByALoli
@KillNiggers
@Stupid Clown
@db-bchr-iv

 

[Seahorsecel]

Germans also used triple shafting on their ships, which might have prevented Battleship Bismarck from escaping to France

Germans used stereoscopic range finders which the British estimated were only competitive for around ~15 minutes or so. From what I read, German FuMo 23 was inferior to allied radar as well.

 

[SoycuckGodOfReddit]

hitler is like bayer leverkusen

like yeah maybe he lost to atalanta or w/e in the final, but his 6 million game unbeaten streak was p impressive

 

[SupremeSaint]

No and the only people who think that are people who played hoi4

 

[weaselbomber]

no
Britain wasn't going to give up and the USSR would push back eventually. A lot of people think taking Moscow would be the ultimate symbol of German victory, but Napoleon took it and we all know what happened.
Sea Lion would've been a logistical nightmare and even if it succeded plagued by resistance, imagine guerrilas in the Scottish highlands
The reason they invaded russia is theory is it would collapse on itself due to a German invasion due to getting raped by Finnish farmers in the Winter War, and it might have if the Germans struck them in the midst of the Stalinist purges, but by 1940 political power was too consolidated under Stalin for that to happen. the only thing the Germans got right from the Winter War is the disastrous state of the Red Army given its post-purge state and still it was a matter of time until they sorted themselves out.
Not to mention that declaring war on the USA was suicidal.

WW1 had much more realistic chances of a German victory

 

[turbocuckcel_7000]

ask /pol/

 

[Seahorsecel]

Only well-thought-out, high-IQ replies, please.

 

[Uggo Mongo]

Yes I've answered this in detail before.

Basically: if Italy didn't invade Greece then Germany's invasion of Russia would have been successful before the winter set in
If they had went for the oil in the caucasus and skirted Moscow
Various other things, and then just extreme bad luck with weather like during Ardennes offensive/battle of the bulge

 

[BlackCel_from_ZA]

Only well-thought-out, high-IQ replies, please.

nigga

 

[SoycuckGodOfReddit]

nigga

 

[kay']

He should have sticked to conquering europe not the whole world.

Attacking ussr was a bad move imo because stalin actually trusted him and was on his side.

Maybe if he won whole europe he could have then declared war on usa with stalin and japan as proper allies.

He wagered it all on defeating the ussr and lost.

 

[Fatass3000]

He should have sticked to conquering europe not the whole world.

Attacking ussr was a bad move imo because stalin actually trusted him and was on his side.

Maybe if he won whole europe he could have then declared war on usa with stalin and japan as proper allies.

He wagered it all on defeating the ussr and lost.

tbf he would won had against the ussr if Italy wasn't dumb and didn't attack Greece

 

[NiggerSlayer]

Despite slaying over 8 million soviet men (and injuring many more) the red army actually grew overall. From my understanding, the Duce also made questionable decisions in north Africa (125,000 Italians encircled by 35,000 Brits) and Greece which forced the Germans to intervene.

I'm not even sure if Hitler could invade Britain, you see the German navy wasn't exactly great. Their ships had many design flaws like:

Distributed armour scheme unheard of since USS Nevada (1914!) instead of the newer, all-or-nothing armour scheme. (all armour on the important bits, paper thin everywhere else)

Massively oversized guns that didn't allow for triple barrels

Oversized ships: German ships were generally much heavier compared to allied vessels but didn't offer much competitive edge (admiral hipper class comes to mind)

15" guns that was only a sidegrade to the WW1 era British 15" despite being around 30 years newer

Prioritizing Plan Z instead of building U-boats

And many more...

Air force I'm not an expert, but from what I've read the Brits shot down much more planes than the Germans during the battle of Britain.

@DarkStarDown
@MoggedByALoli
@KillNiggers
@Stupid Clown
@db-bchr-iv

If they had made the soviets capitulate in 1941 they would've won. Or at least they would've been able to put up a really good fight against the Americans when they joined. But as soon as the soviets started pushing them back, the war was over.

It's crazy to think, if mussolini hadn't begged Hitler for all those troops in North Africa and Greece, they mightve won. Germany would later end up getting right there at the gates of Moscow, those troops mightve made the difference to make that final push into the city. Also no rommel in africa means he probably would've been helping on the eastern front, further helping Germany.

Sure germany made several mistakes in the war, but ultimately i believe if italy stayed neutral (or just didn't have incompetent leadership) them the nazis wouldve won. Beating the soviets = no 2-front war.

Also if japan started a siberian front, that would have helped immensely. Sure the japanese aemy was kind of a joke but it still wouldve directed troops away from the german fromt

Also invading britian was never actually considered, they understood that was just a fantasy and not actually realistic. They were always aiming for a peace deal with the western allies, not total capitulation

 

[NiggerSlayer]

tbf he would won had against the ussr if Italy wasn't dumb and didn't attack Greece

 

[FuckHOA]

Tyrone always wins

 

[kay']

tbf he would won had against the ussr if Italy wasn't dumb and didn't attack Greece

Yea italy fucked up alot too, there were alot of mistakes like dunkirk too.

But i think the gravest one is attacking ussr.

His head got too big and went into many fronts at the same time.

 

[CruxGammata]

if Italy didn't invade Greece then Germany's invasion of Russia would have been successful before the winter set in

But Greek gold reserves were worth it

 

[Quarantined]

no the enemies he made were too strong

 

[kay']

But Greek gold reserves were worth it

Who unbanned this nigga, one month didnt pass yet

Ban him again

 

[CruxGammata]

Who unbanned this nigga, one month didnt pass yet

Ban him again

I know you're glad to see me back.

 

[kay']

I know you're glad to see me back.

 

[db-bchr-iv]

I think we should divide "victory" into two here: Short-term and long-term victory.

Short-term victory: Germany would need to somehow knock the UK out of the war. Otherwise the Brits would eventually drag America into the conflict and history would repeat. Churchill would obviously never, ever surrender or negotiate with the Germans, so the Germans would need to start and win the Battle of France far quicker and somehow convince or coerce (via. the Battle of Britain) Chamberlain's government into an uneasy peace. Sea Lion could likely not succeed (the Kriegsmarine wouldn't be able to hold the channel for long enough and the Luftwaffe simply wasn't big enough) and Churchill would not be coerced into surrendering by simply bombing Britain (apart from nuclear bombing, probably). Even if Germany somehow made significant gains in Sea Lion or nuked Britain, this would provoke America into joining the war, which would mean game over for the Germans.

Then there's the matter of the Soviet Union. Germany and the USSR obviously couldn't coexist as the dominant powers of Europe, so the USSR would have to be dealt with. Perhaps if Barbarossa started earlier and Turkey was convinced to join the conflict (or invaded, although the Germans would have a very hard time crossing the Straits and capturing the vast, mountainous Anatolia), the Germans could take Moscow and capture the oil fields of Trans- and Ciscaucasia. However, pushing any farther would be a logistical nightmare and likely impossible. Therefore, the USSR would stay as a dangerous, looming threat even if they were somehow convinced to stop fighting.

Long-term victory: Now that short-term victory is achieved, we have Germany with highly dissident occupied territories (Yugoslavia, France, Poland, Russia, and possibly Turkey), three major powers still in the game that hate them (the UK, the USSR and the USA) and disillusioned allies that weren't able to gain much in the war (Italy, Hungary, Romania, Bulgaria, possibly Turkey). Germany would likely exhaust much of its remaining military resources trying to hold what they gained, and the British, the Russians and the Americans would likely eventually regroup, convince Germany's European allies to turn against them, and dogpile on Germany.

Perhaps they could scare off their enemies if they were able to develop nukes quickly enough, but Germany would still only dominate Europe, mostly with military might and coercion.

 

[Stupid Clown]

He knew he couldn't win against the UK or America which is why he tried to avoid war with them.

 

[Knajjd]

Who says the war is over? Today German tanks are again up against the Russians. The gap between the end of WW2 and today was just a pause for the belligerents to catch their breath.

The Battle of Britain was a feint. Stalin did not believe Germany would open a two front war with Russia and the UK and was taken by surprise by Operation Barbarossa.

The German planners were appalled with the idea of dividing the Wehrmact into three forces. They preferred a single force directed against Moscow. Like other posters on this thread have said, Mussolini's decision, without consuting his allies, to invade Greece may have saved Moscow.

I also read that 90% of the Nazi state's resources were directed towards the Eastern Front and major German cities were hubs feeding resources into the Eastern Front.

If Germany had won the war they had plans to enlarge Ukraine right up to the river Volga. Why I don't know.

Of course I wasn't there so I don't know what really happened. It could all be BULLSHIT.

 

[Seahorsecel]

Bump

 

[NeverEvenBegan]

Yes, he could. He had boosted confidence from creamping Eva Braun's pussy and overall improved mental AND physical health due to that. It's the type of confidence you can only get if you have regular, non-paid sex. He could have made better decisions.

 

[lifesucksandyoudie]

If they had made the soviets capitulate in 1941 they would've won. Or at least they would've been able to put up a really good fight against the Americans when they joined. But as soon as the soviets started pushing them back, the war was over.

It's crazy to think, if mussolini hadn't begged Hitler for all those troops in North Africa and Greece, they mightve won. Germany would later end up getting right there at the gates of Moscow, those troops mightve made the difference to make that final push into the city. Also no rommel in africa means he probably would've been helping on the eastern front, further helping Germany.

Sure germany made several mistakes in the war, but ultimately i believe if italy stayed neutral (or just didn't have incompetent leadership) them the nazis wouldve won. Beating the soviets = no 2-front war.

Also if japan started a siberian front, that would have helped immensely. Sure the japanese aemy was kind of a joke but it still wouldve directed troops away from the german fromt

Also invading britian was never actually considered, they understood that was just a fantasy and not actually realistic. They were always aiming for a peace deal with the western allies, not total capitulation

I think the main problem still remaining is that the soviets still had way too many reserves and the nazis invaded under the assumption they had way less. They planned everything while underestimating how many reserves the soviets can muster so there was no actual plan that took into account the true scale of soviet mobilization so they couldn't be prepared for it.